Anti-War Action-Baldonnel Sunday,April 16th

by young anarchist - Anarchist Youth (pers cap) Mon Apr 03, 2006 22:02

this is gonna be fun.

by W - Grassroots Dissent Mon Apr 03, 2006 22:10

The luas convoy will be gathering at Connolly station @ 1pm

by guydebord Mon Apr 03, 2006 22:14

http://www.dublinbus.ie/your_journey/viewer.asp?route=68

by W - wsm//anarchist youth Mon Apr 03, 2006 22:29

POSTER

by W - wsm//anarchist youth Mon Apr 03, 2006 22:37

Here's a PDF for those of you with access to laser printers and copiers, no group name on the posters to keep this open and inclusive to all.

http://www.dissentireland.org/baldonnel.pdf

and a smaller version for people to post on forums

http://www.dissentireland.org/baldosmall.jpg

by ('',) Mon Apr 03, 2006 22:38

Nice poster!!!

by dissent dissenter Mon Apr 03, 2006 23:13

bit of a cop out perhaps? all the dignataries in o'connell st with apparatas of state on show, while you's are ten miles away to the south west... bit like AEIP's anti-eu demo - six miles away from farmleigh.

not saying that you'z had to block the 1916 parade, wouldve been very hard to do with cops, etc - but even chanting stuff about shannon and the us army within earshot of the cameras/loudspeakers/stands with all the FFers there in their arrogrance would have been really embarassing to them. even the idea of having to have loads of gards blocking an antiwar protest would be a hughe public relations disaster., now they dont have to worry about their hypocrisy being exposed in such a public way, you's will be out in baldonnel, well out of the spotlight.

a lost opportunity...?

by dissenter Mon Apr 03, 2006 23:20

The state will be doing a fly over which is leaving from baldonnel, thanks to the modern media age images can still reach our leaders of an action in baldonnel even if they aren't there.

There will be so many pigs in the city that no action would be possible at all.

by Oh yeah - Smurfit Mon Apr 03, 2006 23:21

is a much better idea

by AntiWar Mon Apr 03, 2006 23:25

I believe these guys from the 32csm are going to do something against the state parade - http://www.indymedia.ie/article/74805

Map of Area

by Snuffalupagas Mon Apr 03, 2006 23:32

and T-shirts

"Stop Irish support for Imperial War.
Bertie: the heroes of 1916 would be turning in thier graves'

correct me if I'm wrong

totally legal (I think)

by F%&k the 32csm Mon Apr 03, 2006 23:35

F&%K 'em. Brit Security forces stooges

this looks ok

by DISSENT DISSIDENT Mon Apr 03, 2006 23:44

although baldonnel could be good it seems like a crap idea, i mean chances are nothing will happen and it will all have been for nothing, is there any confirmed regular use of baldonnel?

by dissenter Mon Apr 03, 2006 23:46

It's ok you dont have to go and yes there have been reports of repeated use of baldonnel by us military and cia flights.

by d d Tue Apr 04, 2006 00:01

i dont think the possible threat of loads of gards is a reason not to do it in the city. they will just be right on your back instead all the way out there, with three or four separete groups trying to meet up in a part of the city that is hard to get to and not very well known. also how would it look to see hundreds of garda in the city stopping citizens of the state stopping them from going into thier own city?

you men tion about the flyover starting there as a reason for going out there, not sure what the relevence of this is, unless of course you're possibly going to try sand stop the planes leaving, this would be a fairly hardcore DA. if you were going to do something as risk-heavy for arrrest then i cantr see the sense in doing it miles away when a similar risk-heavy DA could be attempted with all the other military hardware in the prarade. with much more people in town, more cams to combat garda brutality, possibly more support from general "non activist" public too.

the rednblack bloc said that they wantedf to put the focus back on the state with their splinter marhc last month. fair enough going to baldonnel is good, but it strikes me as the equivalent of going to the dept of justice when they're all on their holudays. baldonnel will be always be there again for another day, but all the state bukllshit wont be back again in town for years.

by doing an action in town, this would really be focusing it back on the state. everyone will be there. fuck it even if people started booing you if you started chanting slogans abouit the US and shannon and imperialism, it would at least make the crowds orf ordinary punters in town think and talk, rather than sitting back and aplauding it all go by. just even to see the frown on berties face with his glorious day spoiled by having his hypocrisy questioned somewhat would be precious.

i guess it might be too late for yous to seriously reconsider the location but i think yuou should. i thought it was a goer after previous posts here... my €0.02.

by d d (dissent dissenter) Tue Apr 04, 2006 00:07

I see someone else is using my name, or using something similar - so this is the last post I'll use it with. anything else after this which i might post yuou'll have to guess its me

by guydebordisdead Tue Apr 04, 2006 00:14

The idea of confronting the state parade was discussed and it was decided that it would be too dangerous and there was little to be gained by it. People decided to go to Baldonnel instead.

by pp Tue Apr 04, 2006 00:27

"The idea of confronting the state parade was discussed and it was decided that it would be too dangerous and there was little to be gained by it. People decided to go to Baldonnel instead."

TOO DANGEROUS?

Danger is the name of the game.

So is the reason for going to Baldonnel to be safe?

by W Tue Apr 04, 2006 00:42

Baldonnel is the closest place to the city centre where the US military can be targetted, just because we are anarchists that does not mean we should not use clever tactics and fight on our own terms - if all the gardai are in the city where better to be than outside the city.

I'm sure some people would love to see a bloc of 200 or so anarchists confront 3000 assorted army and gardai so that they can denounce us as dangerous and adventurist.

by spider Tue Apr 04, 2006 00:55

what complete crap, this is one of the best actions for ages these criticisms are completely ludicrous. GD should protest the war by protesting the 1916 commemoration TO MAKE BERTIE MAD? wow thats genius that is. all the bloody symbolic protests in the world HAVENT CHANGED ANYTHING, what started out as a genuine mass movement has become the sole preserve of a band of martyrs with more dedication than sense. then wow, somebody comes up with an EXCITING, INSPIRATIONAL idea, that will atttract LOADS of people and totally take the focus of the day and you criticise it for not being the same bloody routine painful horrible protest nonsense. you band of fools. you probably enjoy marching across town every march.

by James Connolly & Padraig Pearse - the ghosts of 1916 past... Tue Apr 04, 2006 01:19

"I'm sure some people would love to see a bloc of 200 or so anarchists confront 3000 assorted army and gardai so that they can denounce us as dangerous and adventurist."

There wouldnt be anything wrong with this my boy. We got the same labels. There were others like MacNeill who would gladly have had us doing marching exercises for ever, just like there are others now who would have revolutionaries do similar marching exercises.

Believe in your convictions. Risk is part of it. Its not just about pissing some politicians off, its about creating an occasion that makes the ordinary people question everything that is happening around them - a revolution in their mindset that rouses them from their apathy. We knew we were fucked from the beginning 90 years ago - but sometimes an insurrection must happen for the revolution to happen too. Yes it will be dangerous, some of you will get hurt, you risk ridicule and imprisonment just as we did - but breaking through to the other side, you will create something incredible.

Your own doubts and paranoia can eat you up... we have faith in you to honour our memory on this day by protesting against these gombeens who claim to represent us by shouting them down... You may not have the same weapons as we did but you (seem to) have the same passion... go for it. Dont be afraid of doing an action in the heart of Dublin. Sometime you will just have to make that hardened jump into the unknown.

by more support Tue Apr 04, 2006 01:30

The black shamrock dot org site is on board with this plan!

by black sham Tue Apr 04, 2006 02:07

"if all the gardai are in the city where better to be than outside the city."

Do you honestly think that there will be no police out at baldonnel? all it will take is 100 gardai to keep any number of anarchists out! They will be there in large numbers.

by Joe - WSM 1st of May (personal capacity) Tue Apr 04, 2006 12:11

From some of these comments it seems some reckon anarchism must always involve ritualised confrontation with the Gardai. Diversity of tactics reduced to the same tactic again and again and again.

In any case the decision to go to Baldonnel was made by some 35 people at the AAA meeting and won't be reversed on indymedia because one or two people reckon they have a better idea. There are anti-war movements that work through allowing people who reckon they have 'better ideas' to over rule decisions made democratically at a meeting but these are not really the sort of movements anarchists are involved in.

If some of you think a protest at the GPO makes more sense then go ahead and organise it. There is no need to try and undermine the Baldonnel protest to organise your own, better to prioirtise what makes sense for you and show solidarity with whatever anyone else decides to do. This isn't a competition, there will be no prize day and no medals for who puts on the best show.

by Starstruck - Grassroots Dissent Tue Apr 04, 2006 16:55

Agree with Joe there.
The venue and type of action was discussed at the last AAA and brought to the Peace Network meeting last meeting.Poeple felt it was pointless to confront the cops and state in the city centre as we would end up herded down a backstreet with no voice.
Baldonnell is somewhere that must be highlighted and what better time to do so when the state are celebrating in the city centre the anti-imperialism we are campaigning for.
Hypocrisy glaring as I said before.

If people wanna go and do a protest in O'Connell Street also,thatd be fantasticGrassroots Dissent and hopefully as many other groups and individuals as possible will be heading to Baldonnel.
There is no one group dominating this-as was said at the Peace Network meeting last Saturday we need actions a\nd groups that include and pluralise our attenpts to stop our involvemnet in this fucking war or we'll never ever succeed.
Everyone in!

by Snuffalupags Tue Apr 04, 2006 23:21

and fair thee well, bold anarchists.

I'm sure you'll have a great time being ignored by the media all the way out in Baldonnell.

Confronting the peelers isn't necessary, merely securing oneself to an imovable object would keep them occupied for long enough. When they ask you to move you say 'I'd love to comply, Garda, truely I would, but unfortunately I can't, as I haven't got the keys. Some gurriers locked me here. They're moving around in a group. Perhaps you could track them down? - they went that way'

I'm curious though as to why you choose to protest at all - surely the idea of protest (correct me if I'm wrong) is to raise awareness of the issues. And i can't think of a better way to do that than by converging on O'connell street as individuals rather than an identifiable group. It appears however that what you wish to do is 'confront the US military'.

I don't wish to rain on your parade but how exactly are you going to accomplish that? Ok, possibly you'll be able to slip by security and get at a plane (unlikely) but that is dependant upon there even being a US plane there to 'get at'. Lots of ifs and buts.

Still the warm rosy glow inside will, I presume, keep you feeling toasty on the long walk home. And the excersize will probably do you all some good. So a fun day for all I should imagine

by C. Tue Apr 04, 2006 23:24

'People felt it was pointless to confront the cops and state in the city centre as we would end up herded down a backstreet with no voice.'

Don't agree Starstruck. You didn't consider all the options, neither did I/we at the time. There is a way to avoid this and pull off a great action in Dublin. Unfortunately, for various reasons, last weekend and 2 meetings went by without discussing/planning for this. Slightly dissapointed AAA decision left no room for manoevre last weekend. Your numbers would be crucial to Dublin nvda action that would work and would be right up your street. Again, unfortunately, not figured out till late on Sat nite. Fuck, I'm as annoyed with myself.

Let us (readers) know if you reconsider your plans.

I'll say it again. If ye decide not to go to Baldonnel and stay in Dublin, there is a plan that will work.

Nice poster W. You said you enjoyed doing them, lovely job.

by cynic Tue Apr 04, 2006 23:33

those who are obviously planning to lock on to either a military vehicle or car or whatever don't need huge crowds to do so, good luck with your action and good luck to those who go to baldonnel. Good luck to the republicans marching in Parnell square too. The Resistance is strong.

by Starstruck - GD Wed Apr 05, 2006 12:15

l"ast weekend and 2 meetings went by without discussing/planning for this"
Not following you there man,the decision was democratically made at the AAA to have the march on Baldonnel,we took that decision to the two meetings last weekend,the Peace Network and the meeting specifically on Baldonnel afterwards.
I dont doubt that we could stage a very effective action in the city centre and people are free to organise one htere if they want but hindsight is 20/20 and GD gave its consent to an action in Baldonnel so thats the way its gotta be.
Theres a meeting this Saturday at 3pm at Trinity,come along if suggestions and ideas are in your mind,unfortunately Indymedia is not the forum for decision-making in this case.

by S'nuffsaid Wed Apr 05, 2006 20:07

those who are obviously planning to lock on to either a military vehicle or car or whatever don't need huge crowds to do so

just like to point out that while a military vehicle would qualify as an 'object', by virtue of it being a 'vehicle' (military or otherwise) it wouldn't qualify as ' immovable'. Also, locking yourself to a, or indeed any, vehicle would be illegal. and we wouldn't want that, now would we?

Sorry 'bout that :)

by I will be in baldonnel as part of a mass! Thu Apr 06, 2006 00:49

You're thinking with your asses if you act without the classes..

"And i can't think of a better way to do that than by converging on O'connell street as individuals rather than an identifiable group."

If you can think of a better way than that then you are obviously braindead.

To Baldonnel!

by Peter Sutherland's Nemesis Fri Apr 07, 2006 14:23

Luas, bicycles, cars, buses - great!
But what time do we converge on Baldonnel?

1. Travelling by Luas from Connolly to ... well, where?
What stop do we get off at?
Are people sure of the way from the last Luas stop to Baldonnel?
How many miles, metres?
How long will it take to walk?

2. If people are driving ... what is the planned meet-up time at Baldonnel?
2.30pm example?

3. By bicycle! It's a great idea.
But has anyone cycled on that road from Hueston to the M50, across it and out the N7. How long should it take I wonder?

4. Bus - the 68 bus. Is it the last stop or what?
Again, are people sure of the way from the last bus stop to Baldonnel?
How many miles, metres?
How long will it take to walk?

I'm all in support of the idea, but if it is an open invitation to anti-war people, and there are no advertised meetings to help organise it, then you need to give out more info.

I'm all in support of the idea, but I'd love to see what Dublin's libertarians would say if the IAWM was organising this gig: "sell out, you have the chance to disrupt the official parade and you run away. You have a chance to highlight government complicity in imperialist war and torture and you run away".

I will be in O'Connell St with an anti-torture and anti-complicity in imperialist war sign myself. Where the TV cameras from around the world will be.

Remember the invective when the IAWM got people to protest as close as possible to the hotel in Clare where Bush was instead of at the actual Shannon airport? Remember the cribbing and roaring when the SWP, Sinn Fein and others got people to march from the city centre to Hueston station instead of to where the EU leaders were actually meeting back in May 2004.

I just don't understand the logic of not confronting the pseudo-republican bullshit government 1916 pageant.

by W Fri Apr 07, 2006 19:10

We have all of that INFO and have invited all of the anti-war groups to an open meeting tomorrow to co-ordinate and finalise the plans.

The luas people will be meeting the critical mass people at the red cow roundabout and it's a 30minute march from there, you can ask the bus driver to let you off at the nearest to baldonnel and he will oblige.

The Open organising meeting is tomorrow @ 3pm meeting outside trinity college.

by antiwar Sun Apr 09, 2006 19:20

Meeting went really well yesterday, look out baldonnel here we come!

by organiser Tue Apr 11, 2006 18:00

Reclaim luas cancelled due to overly long march required to get you to baldonnel from red cow,

Get bus 69 @ 1.25pm or 68 @ 1.55pm - from wood quay.
(dublin bus say busses should be leaving from wood quay on the day instead of aston quay)

Critical Mass is still @1pm from Heuston stn.

There will be people posted at the original meeting points to direct you where to go.

by phm Tue Apr 11, 2006 18:19

This demo (no doubt, with all the usual suspects in attendance), seems to be mis-named. Its correct title should be anti-any- war-in-which-the-US-is involved-only.

Iraq is a mere side-show. The real big big war (ten years and continuing) is on the north-eastern marches of the Democratic Republic of the Congo where the socialist kleptocrats who run Uganda and Zimbawe (and their client militias - including the unlovely child-murderers of the Lords Resistance Army) are pursuing a vicious war of agression for control of the mineral wealth of the region.

Yet there has not been one single protest by our trotsko-fascists against this obscenity which has cost upwards of 2 million human lives outside the offices of the Ugandan or Zimbawbean charge d'affairs here. Could it possibly be because the Kleptocrat Mugabe is a socialist icon and because there is no US involvement?

by Starstruck Tue Apr 11, 2006 18:25

Well Phm,if you want to see some action taken on this issue,I suggest
you rouse yourself from your position as Internet Critic ,leave the house
and do something or other about it,rather than criticising those who have
the courage to follow through on their convictions.Or maybe just become a character in Beavis and Butthead-sounds like thats your chosen lifestyle...
Oh yeah..

Armchair experts!

by chekov - 1 of Indymedia Ireland Editorial Group Tue Apr 11, 2006 18:36 chekov at indymedia dot ie

The real big big war (ten years and continuing) is on the north-eastern marches of the Democratic Republic of the Congo where the socialist kleptocrats who run Uganda and Zimbawe (and their client militias - including the unlovely child-murderers of the Lords Resistance Army) are pursuing a vicious war of agression for control of the mineral wealth of the region.

Yet there has not been one single protest by our trotsko-fascists against this obscenity which has cost upwards of 2 million human lives outside the offices of the Ugandan or Zimbawbean charge d'affairs here. Could it possibly be because the Kleptocrat Mugabe is a socialist icon and because there is no US involvement?

It is rare that somebody gets every single detail in a post so spectacularly wrong. To start:

1. Neither Uganda or Zimbabwe are remotely close to being socialist, they don't describe themselves as such and nobody with a clue would describe them as such.

2. Neither Uganda or Zimbabwe are involved in the war in DRC any more. Zimbabwe pulled out of the south in 2001, Uganda pulled out in 2004-5

3. The LRA is based in northern uganda and is fighting against the Ugandan government. It has never been involved in the DRC

4. The UN estimate for the death toll in the DRC was at about 4 million in 2000.

5. There is US involvement - the major foreign involvement in the East is the Rwandan RPF and they are a US client. Their leadership was trained in the US. The major foreign involvement on the side of the Kinshasa government is the Angolan army, once again supported by the US. In addition, there are multiple US, Canadian and South African mineral extraction companies who generally run their own private armies.

Idiot.

by Snuffsaid - Smurf Tue Apr 11, 2006 20:21

dear oh dear

Reclaim luas cancelled due to overly long march required to get you to baldonnel from red cow

Above you have a perfect! example of why I tend to avoid meetings, like the plague

Not only was I chastised for supporting something slightly (IMHO) more effective but was informed that

In any case the decision to go to Baldonnel was made by some 35 people at the AAA meeting and won't be reversed on indymedia because one or two people reckon they have a better idea.

and not one of those fine 35-brains realised that the walk from the Mad Cow to Baldonnel might be a bit of an overly long march!. And on a very busy dual carraige-way (unless you were planning on using the road that runs by the Green Isle Hotel parralell to the Naas Dualler. Oh dear :( It might have helped were there someone in attendance who might have known something about the roads and distances involved (ahem :)

There are anti-war movements that work through allowing people who reckon they have 'better ideas' to over rule decisions made democratically at a meeting but these are not really the sort of movements anarchists are involved in.

That's all very civilized and all but this the original descision does seem like a perfect indictment of democracy. Personally I thought anarchists didn't have much truck with 'democracy'. Seems I was mistaken.

Are they having Mass said in Baldonell as well? - shall I bring communion?

by Braindead - Smurfette Tue Apr 11, 2006 20:40

been printed and flyposted already - haven't they? Oh dear oh dear. I'm so glad I'm braindead like the author of this comment:

Still the warm rosy glow inside will, I presume, keep you feeling toasty on the long walk home. And the excersize will probably do you all some good. So a fun day for all I should imagine

by organised! Wed Apr 12, 2006 00:01

We will have people stationed at connolly and aston quay co-ordinating the transport for the day. Over 400 text msg invites have been sent out, hundreds of leaflets and posters with the correct info are being proliferated. The Baldonnel demo is an open and public demo, all are welcome.

See you there.

Poster Updated!

by To Badonnel! Wed Apr 12, 2006 17:21

Easter Sunday and Easter Monday will bring a good deal of dry weather with a mix of cloudy periods and sunny spells

INTERMITTENT CLOUDS 4 to 11 °C

by ! Sat Apr 15, 2006 13:22

How much will the bus cost tommorrow? I haven't been on one for so long...

by bus conductor - dublin bus Sat Apr 15, 2006 19:32

the fare to baldonnel is 1.80 (not 1.85 like most routes)

by ('',) - AY Sat Apr 15, 2006 21:00

But for us 'kids' its 65cent.

by B Sat Apr 15, 2006 22:42

Connolly station 1p.m..

by ! Sat Apr 15, 2006 23:47

People coming tommorrow please bring lots of food and water. Its going to be a warm day and there won't be any shops out in Baldonnel.

Not forgetting - Flags, drums, banners, sound systems and money for da bus!

by CM Sun Apr 16, 2006 11:15

There will be a Anti-War Critical Mass from Heuston Station 1pm