George W Bush coming to Dublin in May or June

by s.d. Mon Nov 17, 2003 15:00

consider the tired antiwar movement in ireland REVIVED!

the irish left has no excuse now to be sectarian and self-defeating, it is a time to come together, right now...

by Bri Mon Nov 17, 2003 15:18

but sorry if i come across sectarian or any such thing, all of the above but without RBB holding people back on behalf of the IAWM!

by B. Barry Mon Nov 17, 2003 21:59

Get real. Bush was elected according to the laws of the land. Why he would waste his time in Ireland is beyond me.

by Corran - IAWM & GR Tue Nov 18, 2003 00:22

lets start buliding now. lets show that murdering bastard hes not welcome. not here not ever.

by Mary J Tue Nov 18, 2003 02:33

No, 'B. Barry', lets be accurate here, Bush was Court-appointed.
Ask Jeb, he should know.

by Irish Bush Admirer Tue Nov 18, 2003 03:03

I will be delighted to welcome a great American President to our shores. He is the greatest American Leader since another great Republican, Abraham Lincoln (he set a lot of people free too, and had to go to war to do it).

BTW, Bush won enough votes in Florida to make it necessary to cut short the perpetual recounts by a court order. It's as simple as that, sore losers.

The most hypocritical thing about those who opposed the Iraq war is that they would not have objected in the slightest if it was Bill Clinton sending in the bombers. Hypocites, history will prove the greatness of George Walker Bush.


Bush-Cheney - another 4 years!!

by David C. Tue Nov 18, 2003 03:52

Here's the truth on the 2000 Florida fiasco, as determined by a consortium of US newspapers:
- If the recount had happened only in the counties that Gore had requested, then Bush would have still won, but...
- If the recount had been done in ALL Florida counties then Gore would have won by several thousand.

Remember, however, that the only reason the election was even close was because
1) The butterfly ballot/Jews-for-Buchanan thing
2) The removal of about 70,000 valid minority voters from the electoral rolls by a republican-controled company hired by Jeb Bush to track down felons who were voting.

It is clear that many, many more (~100k) went to the polls in Florida to try to vote for Gore than vote for bush.

The fact is that Gore won. Bush became president because of technical errors at best, and possibly because of worse. This is a close to a fact as anything can be, regardless of how much republicans may shout and bully.

The US under the republicans needs a HUGE slap upside the head. At the moment it seems that only the heroic Iraqi resistance are providing that, but perhaps the British can contribute this week. Another year of having their face rubbed in shit in Iraq should make Americans much more responsible at the polls in 2004...

Oh, and please don't forget to boycott all American goods and also don't hesitate to tell any Americans that you meet how you feel about their country's thuggery. They are citizens of a piriah state, and they should know that.

by Sara G. Tue Nov 18, 2003 04:14

It's okay. The next election won't be nearly as close as the last one. Bush will win in a landslide.

by Morgan Tue Nov 18, 2003 04:25

If the recount had been done, the result would have been.....

Have you got a crystal ball???

by Morgan Tue Nov 18, 2003 04:27

"heroic Iraqi resistance"...


Sorry, I mistook you for a sane person. Carry on in your topsy-turvy world, never mind me.

by David C Tue Nov 18, 2003 05:40

I don't see how referring to the Iraqi resistance as 'heroic' makes me insane. I abhor the bombings of the UN, Red cross, etc, but there is no evidence that this is the work of the resistance (more likely it was Al Quaida, because it fits their pattern). The Iraqi resistance is just ordinary men and women with few resources who have chosen to stand and fight an immensely powerful enemy who places very little value on Iraqi life. And they seem to be winning, and in the process tying down a military that would otherwise be making war elsewhere in the middle east or in Asia. No matter which side you're on, any honest person can see that these people are heroic.

Do you think that if Iraq had occupied the US then the American resistance would be treating the iraqi occupiers better than the iraqi resistence is treating the Americans now?

Remember the Star Wars films? Well I didn't root for Darth Vader either...

Regarding the 2000 election:
Here's the link to the NORC's Florida Ballot project, containing the actual data supporting Gore's win; http://www.norc.uchicago.edu/fl/index.asp . This technical data and some of the press reaction is interpreted at http://www.consortiumnews.com/2001/040601a.html
Remember, these are hard facts based on real data (ie the 180,000 Florida ballots that weren't counted) and 8 months of research. But this just considers actual ballots cast - it doesn't consider the 4000 Gore votes lost to Butterfly Ballots or the 70,000 minority Floridians who were disenfrancised by Jeb Bush's contractor.

Gore won the 2000 election, but bush became president. Stop and think about this for a minute.

by dan c Tue Nov 18, 2003 05:54

George Bush cannot and will not win in 2004's election. The American people grow more critical of the President's actions in Iraq as more of our troops die and as new information about how the adminsitration lied and misused CIA intelligence. His tax cuts are bogus and the ones going to the extremly weathly should be repealed. He has not risen minimum wage. The administration gave huge contracts out to Haliburton WITHOUT BIDDING!!! Haliburton has wasted $100 million of American tax dollars so far in Iraq. What is happening is that even though Iraq has tons of oil it has a shortage of gasoline. Haliburton was given the job to bring gasoline from Kuwait to Iraqi gas stations. Now Kuwaiti gasoline goes for about 10-50 cents per gallon and Iraqi gas stations sell their gasoline for around a dollar a gallon. Haliburton is buying gasoline from Kuwait for TWO DOLLARS AND FIFTY CENTS! Bush has no chance as long as the American people become informed about this which they are everyday.

by Sara G. Tue Nov 18, 2003 06:05

He's not insane, just an idiot. I just love the thought of you going Kucinich when Bush wipes out the Democrats in 2004. It's going to be beautiful. Then what will you do?

by David C Tue Nov 18, 2003 06:26

Lets wait and see what actually happens in 2004 before anyone 'goes Kucinich'!

Here's my take on the options in 2004:

If Americans decisively reject the Bush Administration then America can rejoin the world and the whole 'it's-not-Americans,-it's-just-bush' argument will have been proven valid. After all, more Americans voted for Gore that bush, so why should they all be smeared with the same brush?

If, on the other hand, Americans validate bush and decisively approve of him continuing in power, then it will be clear that the problem is not with Bush - its with Americans. If this happens then I think that America will become much more isolated from the rest of the world. Americans will not be welcome outside their borders, American goods will be avoided, foreign investments will be retreived (actually they already are leaving), military cooperation will slow down, etc. It will be them vs. us, with 'us' being the rest of the planet (other than Israel, of course). If you disagree with this then I suggest you take a look at the recent Pew Research survey on attitudes towards America in 21 countries.

But I don't think that will happen. There are many tens of millions of decent Americans who want to feel proud of their country again. I think those people will prevail in the end.

by berniebird Tue Nov 18, 2003 07:42 New York

Hate to be the cynical bastard here, folks, but the reality of the matter is that is most likely Bush will win the next election.
Most Americans are ignorant fucks and have no comprehension of the hatred towards their country, and how it has intensified outside the Muslim world in the last two years. Xenophobia is on the rise here and more and more can be heard the murmurings of "Napalm" in the bars. Obliviousness and insensitivity to the lives of foreigners on every level as Fox News pumps out its poison and the public sing along... pound the Arab fuckers!
Some months ago, when I mentioned the Ploughshares action at Shannon to an American workmate, when they smashed up the plane, he responded "They should have been shot!"
"But Ireland is supposed to be a neutral country," I said.
"I don't care... they should have been shot!"
In all seriousness, I have been having difficulties persuading my workmates over to the idea of Evolution... I even wrote an piece for you guys on that... http://www.indymedia.ie/newswire.php?story_id=60132
The American people are spiraling into idiocy, and can only put their trust into an idiot just like them in times of such fear.
They need help... they need a guiding hand... and maybe the Irish are the ones to do it, to reintroduce some rationality to their thoughts, before they kill us all...
I am tired sometimes of doing this alone... this is my mission here in America... send support...

by Sara G. Tue Nov 18, 2003 16:33

No, most Americans don't care what other countries think about America. Do you really think we sit around worrying about what the Irish or the French think about us? Don't like it, then stop buying our food, stop watching our movies, stop taking our money.

by Steelie Tue Nov 18, 2003 16:35

Sarah, I love America, but didn't realise that there was money going. Where do I collect my greenbacks from?

by Joe S Tue Nov 18, 2003 17:11

Sara G,
Would that the be money stolen from countries that are raped by US foreign policy?
Believe me we do not take your money it is here so multinationals can make more money, No multinational invests in Ireland because it is dear old ireland rather for how much money it will make them.
We do not get handouts from the US government, this is Ireland not Israel.
Bush is an Idiot and the election was bought with the help of his daddy and money from the multinationals he is paying back now by allowing them to rape and pilage Afghanistan, Iraq and many other countries in the world.
I hope that Junior does not get a second term as he is the greatest danger to the world more than all others together, an idiot with huge weapons capability.

by barry Tue Nov 18, 2003 19:09

I didn't realise americans sat around thinking!!!!

by David C. Tue Nov 18, 2003 19:18

-Stop pricing oil and other commodities in US dollars (Russia is taking the lead on this - it helps devalue the dollar)
-Stop relying on the American military for basic security (The EU rapid reaction force, Galilio project and Korean withdrawals are big steps in that direction)
-Stop traveling to the US for tourism or study (Already happening very quickly)
-Stop making americans feel welcome abroad (also already happening)
-Stop cooperating in 'flaky' law enforcement issues (US-designated 'terrorists' are already being freed throughout the world)
-Stop investing in US bonds and equities (Guess why the dollar has dropped so much against the euro and yen for the past 2 yrs!)
-Stop taking US foreign aid (Just kidding! There is none - except to Israel and Egypt)
-Stop trading so much with the US (After several years of WTO legal process the tarrifs will be going on american goods next month!)
-Stop consuming american products and services (consumer-led boycotts are happening everywhere. Tried to buy a coke lately in the middle east?)
-Stop automatic political cooperation with the US (good progress on this in Palestinian policy, etc)
- etc.
- etc.

And all this is in spite of the fact that most intelligent people make a distinction between Bush and America. Imagine what will happen is Americans deceisively vote for bush to continue in power?

The word 'Pariah' won't be enough to describe it!

But it won't happen. Most Americans are not that stupid, and so Bush will lose and the US will be rehabilitated in the world. That's the right thing and the most likely thing.

by Sara G. Wed Nov 19, 2003 00:09

By taking our money I meant selling your products to us. If you don't want us to buy from you, fine. If you don't want us to visit your country and bring dollars, fine.

If, on the other hand, you want to do business with us, then get over it.

by David C Wed Nov 19, 2003 04:21

It IS fine! Its very fine! Its a fine thing indeed!

by Albo Thu Nov 20, 2003 17:23

Sara G,

As a Superpower, what America does has a serious affect on what happens in the rest of the world.

America is not like other countries. They agressively push their policies on the rest of the world.

It's not simply a case of "If we don't like them, we can just ignore them" - because so many other countries are indirectly ruled by America. We have to put up with it whether we like it or not.

Because they are the most economically and militarily powerful country, we are forced to appease them.

You may say "we don't care what other countries think of us", but that is just like the school bully who will not care what the smaller kids think of him. He's still going to take their lunch money.