Thousands March to Remember Loughgall Martrys

by Loughgall20 Tue May 08, 2007 19:20 osfnational at yahoo dot ie

Remembered with pride!

by Ex-Shinner Tue May 08, 2007 20:04

20 Years later you are pledging to help bigots and homophobes to administer privatisation. A great tribute to republican martyrs.

by KW Tue May 08, 2007 20:37

And you are tapping away on your keyboard, attacking Republicans instead of doing anything constructive. Great.

by Bemused - None Wed May 09, 2007 11:52

Who are you kidding??

They were real tough when the PIRA were abducting, torturing and killing defenceless women.

When they came up against armed soldiers they were blown away. Good riddance.

by J Wed May 09, 2007 13:50

Great to see huge numbers of young people and ogra coming out to remember the Loughgall Martyrs - from the look of the pictures -some wouldn't have been born at the time.

Inspiartional are those who lay down there lifes in the struggle against Imperialism. May the youth continue to honour their memory.

Onwards young comrades! For Loughgall!

by The knowledge Wed May 09, 2007 15:44

...nothing on The Informer then? Not burnt in effigy?

by Tim Fallon Wed May 09, 2007 15:48

The 8 men were all heavily armed with assault rifles and they had gone to Loughall to attack the RUC station with a bomb carried in the bucket of a digger.
They detonated the bomb partly demolishing the RUC station and were cut down by the SAS soldiers who were waiting to ambush them in a fierce exchange of gun fire.
The IRA men knew the risks.

by Andy McNab Wed May 09, 2007 16:14

Just after 7pm, Declan Arthurs drove the JCB carrying the bomb through the perimeter fence of the RUC station. The van carrying the rest of the IRA unit pulled up and they jumped out and opened fire on the station. The IRA just managed to detonate its 200lb bomb before the SAS opened fire, heavily damaging the police station.

The SAS riddled the JCB and the van with bullets. In addition, the car of passer-by Anthony Hughes was fired on by the SAS. Hughes, 36, was killed and his brother badly wounded. Subsequent security forces statements said with regret that they had been innocent passers-by caught in crossfire. All eight IRA men were killed, all from head wounds (allegedly they were each finished off with a coup de grace but this remains unproved).The soldiers fired more than 600 rounds; the PIRA men fired 70 rounds but did not hit any of the soldiers. It was later alleged that one of the dead men was in fact an informant for the RUC, although this was denied by security sources, who claimed that the information on the PIRA unit was gained from electronic surveillance.

The British recovered eight IRA weapons from the scene - three Heckler & Koch rifles, one FN rifle, two FNC rifles, a Ruger revolver and a Spas-12 shotgun. The Royal Ulster Constabulary linked the guns to 7 murders and 12 attempted murders in the mid Ulster area. One of the guns had been taken from a reserve RUC constable murdered in an attack on police two years earlier.

The innocent civilian, Anthony Hughes, who was shot dead by the SAS had been travelling in a car with his brother, Oliver, unaware of the ambush. Unfortunately, both brothers were wearing blue overalls similar to those sometimes worn by IRA members on operations and so were mistaken for IRA men engaged in the attack. As they attempted to reverse out of the gunfire, SAS troopers positioned nearby mistook them as part of the IRA unit and opened fire. Forty shots were aimed at the car, killing Anthony and wounding his brother. Hughes' widow later received compensation from the British Government for the death of her husband

by Andy McNab Wed May 09, 2007 16:25

http://www.stuff.themutual.net/nil2.jpg

The above photo shows the bullet riddled Hiaca beside the roadside wooden fence in the aftermath of the ambush directly across the road from the RUC station. The white rods in the side of the vehicle represent the trajectories of the bullets. As you can see the windshield was also bullet riddled. The red patch on the road beside the nearest front wheel is a pool of blood where the late Jim Lynagh fell mortally wounded.

by Roisin Wed May 09, 2007 21:38

It is much appreciated that people remember my brother and his comrades. I am sorry to have to correct this but the pool of blood at the front of the hiace van belongs to my brother Vol Patrick Kelly - he had 38 bullets fired into his body from the waist upwards - one behind the ear and his tooth ripped out - presumably taken as a trophy by the SAS. Vol Jim Lynagh was in the back of the van - 125 bullets were fired into the van by the SAS.

by Andy McNab Thu May 10, 2007 10:13

I am sorry that your brother died. I am sure you and your family miss him terribly. He was certainly a very brave young man.

But he and his other comrades were heavily armed and set out to fight against other heavily armed men.

It was a fair fight.

Once the bullets were flying someone had to lose.

Regarding his tooth being torn out - warriors in every age have always taken tokens from their dead enemies.

Big Boy's Games Big Boy's Rules.

Thankfully nobody has to die in Northern Ireland anymore.
The guns are silent and both societies are at peace now.

by monaghan man Thu May 10, 2007 10:40

Fair play to you andy mc nab for admitting these lads were "brave young men" and not giving the usual internet crap about them being terrorists. I knew Jim very well and he certainly was brave. He fought and died and he always knew the risks. We're all proud of the loughall Martyrs in Ireland but it's great to see no more young lads doing time or heading to an early grave.

by Andy McNab Thu May 10, 2007 12:30

IRA members, UVF members, RUC officers, British soldiers etc.- were all combatants.
They were not innocent
It should be no suprise to anyone that in the years of violence in Northern Ireland that people who were republican paramilitaries, loyalist paramilitaries or members of the British security forces were fair game whether "on duty" or "off duty."

That's war.

It is a ruthless cruel business irrespective of whether the causes of either side are just or not. Everyone understands that if you take up a gun you have to accept death is an occupational hazard.

But we should remember the ordinary innocent people who were in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Whether the 14 demonstrators shot dead on Bloody Sunday by the Paras, those who were shot dead in the Kingsmill massacre by the IRA or those killed by loyalists at the Rising Sun - all of them killed without justification.

We must remember all those innocents who were singled out and killed by self-appointed executioners simply for being Protestant or Catholic.

Now that Northern Ireland is at peace and Paisely and McGuinness are now sitting down we must hang our heads in shame peace could not have been secured before so many needless and tragic innocent deaths.

by Observer Thu May 10, 2007 13:06

Roisin, I never knew your brother, but I did know you at the time this happened. I am sorry that you lost a loved one in the troubles. Many people got caught up in this, and their lives would have been better employed in other ways.

However, it also has to be said that your brother's organisation inflicted appalling atrocities during its 'war.' A neighbour of mine is typical. He was having a quiet drink in his local pub when an IRA man burst in and shot him in the head. His crime? Nothing - it turned out the IRA man was looking for a local contractor doing police work, and mistook my neighbour for this individual. There are far too many stories of this kind for anybody to claim victimhood and holy sanctity.

You mention 125 bullets fired into the van your brother was in. Would it have been any better had there been only one? What about the people also that the IRA slaughtered - the man for example tied to a bomb in Derry which was detonated when he approached a checkpoint? Was that humane and justified??? Did your brother's organisation follow normal rules of engagement?

The truth is that this war demeaned us all. It was a waste of time. It was always unwinnable - you cannot inflict a political settlement in the North against the wishes of most people living there. You can argue about what ought or should be the casee in terms of national rights, but I am talking here hard practicalities - you simply cannot succeed in implosing a united Irelabnd against united Protestant opposition, and especially and more so when most Catholics North and South of the bordert also oppose the said military campaign. The IRA campaign was inevitably going to end with its ends unachieved.

In essence, the IRA men who died in Loughgall died in vain. There was no need for it, no positive outcome realistically in prospect. Their deaths are a tragic loss. The only good thing is that it looks like we will have no more of them. For that, I am grateful.

by Monaghan Man Thu May 10, 2007 13:07

Andy,

I know exactly what you mean. Each combatant knew the risks and pitfalls of armed struggle and you know yourself, being an Ex-Brit soldier, civillian deaths were the awful tragedy of the whole era.- just look at the civillian casualities now in Iraq. If it is hard for ex IRA volunteers to stomach the new found era at the moment just imagine how other people who lost loved ones feel.

It's was weird from a republican perspective watching Mc Guinness and Paisley up at stormont together 20 years to the day when Jim and the boys got killed by the SAS. If it was'nt for the conflict Andy would we ever have seen this day? or do you think it would have come anyway if we followed the step down lower party's [SDLP] way ?

Kind regards

by Gandhi of North Strand Thu May 10, 2007 13:20

Sunningdale offered a better deal, 3,500 have died in vain, GFA was designed to put both extremes in power, and remove the middle ground, FF have succeed in what they set out to do under Lynch in the late 60's / early 70's ie the replacement of the growing Republican movement with a Nationalist Movement. Their fear has always been of Republician /Socialism they never feared Republician/ Nationalism. The sooner the better the process is fully completed and FF merge with the Provisionals.

The Republic lives on in the hearts and minds of Republicians and will re - emerge in the years to come as the only long term viable solution .

by Stuart Thu May 10, 2007 14:08

Hi all,

I am a Northern Protestant.
The great tragedy of 20th century Ireland was the lack of communication between Republican and Unionist tradition.
I read a biography of Michael Collins - before 1916 he lived in London where he only wore only Irish tailored clothing, listened to only Irish music, played only Irish games and read onlyIrish literature and of course he was also an extreme Irish nationalist and yet he worked a clerk in the heart of the City.
The could easily said about Unionists in the North - English on Irish soil.
Both sides storing up hatreds and emnities.
It reminds me of the modern day Muslims extremists who live among us now in British and Irish cities on both these islands living as if they were in Peshwar instead.

It is truly bizarre that it was in the trenches of World War 1 that the Unionists and Republicans fought side by side and died for eachother!

I truly believe that the 1916 rising copper fastened partition - the troubles of the early twenties created and solidified the two hated filled traditions of uncompromising Republicanism and Unionism.
The extremists of the UVF led by Carson grabbed their piece of the island and the extremists of the IRA and Free State grabbed their portion.
Boths sides created repressive theocratic states insulated from the outside world and eyeing eachother across the border.

It was in Cork and Kerry deep in the south west where republicanism was at its most extreme and it was in Antrim in the north east that extremist unionists were in control.

Poles Apart!

Maybe we could be united country i don't know. Probably not.

But I do know that we can live together.

by Lee Klegg Thu May 10, 2007 14:21

I have no sympathy for those pira scum we slotted.
I was tapdancing while I was shooting.

by Caobhin Thu May 10, 2007 15:13

It is truly bizarre that it was in the trenches of World War 1 that the Unionists and Republicans fought side by side and died for eachother!

no republicans died as cannon fodder in the trenches - they were home rulers deluded by Redmond and his kind - a sacrafice for the empire that was rewarded by their eloctoral oblivion and eternal irrelevancy.

And "Klegg", who cares that you took the time off from pulling the wings off flies to gloat over the state terrorist execution of these brave men - at the end of the day the opinion of servile scum like you is irrelevant.

by Monaghan Man Thu May 10, 2007 15:45

Well Lee

You were doing a bit of tapdancing when you were shooting in loughgall that evening........thats very harsh talk in this present political climate. I'm sure we could start having a slagging match over this page but what good would it do?

your comments are'nt welcome if all you want to do is stirr up shit. I could write here now about all the soldiers the 'Ra "slotted" [as you put it] but whats the point. It's just a pity that one of the lads never "slotted" a prick like you before he met his maker that evening.

Regards

by Stuart Thu May 10, 2007 20:25

Relax Caobhin, "Klegg" scarcely merits a response.
Probably a fifteen year old kid more likely.

But I cannot agree that when British soldiers open fire on armed guerrillas who are in the act of blowing up a police station is "state terrorist execution."

The eight IRA heavily armed men who died while shooting back at Loughall were not exactly helpless lambs like other victims of the "shoot-to-kill" policy who could have been arrested rather than shot dead as a supposed deterrant e.g. the four IRA who were shot a Girbalter.

If you want to honour these men I have no problem with that - although I cannot agree with their extremist nationalism I do admire their bravery.
Instead of cowardly shooting dead innocent men women and children like other IRA units - Mr Lynagh and co actually picked a fair fight with the security forces.

On the loyalist side, I don't think Johnny Adair and other self-styled soldiers were going to attack an Irish Army barracks across the border were they?

Even the loyalist "hero" Michael Stone couldn't fight fair - he shot dead unarmed mourners when he couldn't kill Adams and McGuinness who would have been legitimate targets.

As regards the "cannon-fodder" Republicans who you so shamefully dismiss - I appear to remember that many of the bravest Republicans who later fought the Black and Tans and fought in the Civil War in the south were ex-British Army.

by Ex-Shinner Thu May 10, 2007 22:59

How do you know I'm not doing anything constructive? You don't know me. For your information, I am still a republican activist. Just not with Sinn Féin.

Just pointing out the 'great work' that SF are doing. Sitting down in Government with Homophobes and bigots, changing your policies to get into government with right-wingers in the 26 counties. Supporting the PSNI unconditionally, preventing people from speaking at the special Ard-Fheis. Sending letters to elected reps telling them basically that they have to vote yes on policing. The hypocrisy gets a little bit much after a while.

by Free Stater Fri May 11, 2007 13:35

May 9th Irish Times names: 3,722 dead between 1966 - 2007.

2,154 killed by 'republicans'

1,112 by 'loyalists'

367 killed by security forces

89 killed by 'others'.

Let's remember the 3,722 above all. We are living on an island and rely on other economies to pay our way. Killing helped nobody. Let's keep all the past lies out of our future. No more Loughgall or Orange marches please - down south we're not impressed by either.

by Caobhin Fri May 11, 2007 15:28

Free Stater - Your statistics mask the fact that the loyalist gangs were heavily supported by and were effectively agents of, the brit govt. State terror also includes the routine torture and false imprisonement of tens of thousands not to mention the general political repression and criminalisation of part of the community - state terror which did much to prolong the northern conflict.

And Stuart, I am pointing out that the Irish who fought in WWI were home rulers - republicans opposed the war and conscription. That many who survived the imperialist murder jamboree became republicans only underlines this fact.

by rooster Fri May 11, 2007 17:47

they had planned to blow up a small rural police station and then to machine gun any survivors, hardly the acts of innocent people, they went out that night to murder and thats what happened.

by Dub Fri May 11, 2007 17:48

I wonder if those lads who died that day would have supported joining the police that they were trying to kill when they were shot by the SAS and sitting in the parliment that they were trying to destroy by force of arms....who knows.

by Patriot Fri May 11, 2007 17:55

McGuinness, Adams et al are traitors.

The Irish Republic lives on among the few who still dare to uphold it and fight for it.

Until Ireland is a Brit-free, Prod-free, 32 county, Socialist, Gaelic, Catholic Republic it will never be at peace.

by rooster Fri May 11, 2007 19:20

No dub, those lads that died that day would have had views that meant they were stuck in the past so maybe it was a good thing that there not around anymore as it will give peace a chance, in the same way that its good that billy wright is no longer with us. And, as for a Brit-free, Prod-free, 32 county, Socialist, Gaelic, Catholic Republic, what would be the point in that?

by Kevin T. Walsh - Social Justice and Ethics Fri May 11, 2007 21:15

Rooster
Constipation is a very serious complaint. The choices in modern times vary from fruit and fibre, all bran, night classes in History on Sherriff Street, lectured by the Monk or in the Connemara, we have black jollop and that sure removes all the sh.. out of you.

Now Rooster I notice you are a very good critic on Indymedia and I admire your comments on Catholic Ireland, Catholic prod ..... totally equally, living together, diddely doo and as Paisley jnr said today, 'we respect our neighbours i.e. Latvians, Lithuanians, Polish, Russians, Croatians, Nigerians, Romanians' or Did He? No he did not Rooster.

You see Rooster, the Big Hen is speaking now and you listen little boy to Big Hen - not Big Ian, Big Hen. You are right Rooster, we could not afford a nationwide health free system - have you any idea of the level of syphllis among the roosters in D4 and D6 - it is beyond belief. Even the family pooch refused to sleep with them. Yet McDowell gets their vote - now why is that Rooster.

You see Rooster, I had a baby rooster once and he was born free in Connemara. He had free range sex and free range eggs and free range little chicks. Now Rooster - could you please write us an article on the Evolution of you became a Rooster?

Donald Duck said once - when you quack too much, people cop on you are an idiot and your friends duck and dive to avoid you.

Quotation
Dian Fossey 1932-1985 US primatologist
'When you realise the value of all life, you dwell less on what is past and concentrate more on the preservation of the future'.

by True Republican Sat May 12, 2007 21:24

Isn't it funny that the shamed Provos went to Galbally instead of attending the unveiling of a monument organised by the families of those murdered in Loughgall?

by Roisin Sun May 13, 2007 00:41

Andy and others, I was only correcting an inaccuracy about who was at the front of the van. I am not here to defend or argue for or against what anyone has said or done in this conflict - it seems so easy when they are dead. Grief doesn't discriminate.

by Tyrone Republican Sat May 26, 2007 14:43

'Until Ireland is a Brit-free, Prod-free, 32 county, Socialist, Gaelic, Catholic Republic it will never be at peace.'

I would agree with this statement in that true peace cannot be gained until freedom is achieved- however why do u include 'prod free’ and ‘catholic republic’. Religion shouldn’t come into the equation whatsoever. There are many republicans who were protestant, indeed Wolfe tone was himself a Presbyterian.

Sectarianism is a tool used by the British- the old adage of divide and conquer. Republicans shouldn’t be sectarian.

However I would agree with the statement

'Until Ireland is a Brit-free, 32 county, Socialist, Gaelic, Republic it will never be at peace.'

by Patrick Henry Sat May 26, 2007 16:31

What has changed since these men set out to bomb that Police Station? Nothing except that SF have taken over from the SDLP and are serving in a Paisley-led Government. Their leader Adams has praised the British PM for his commitment to the 'Peace Process' forgetting his Government's part in the oppression of our people and while he kills civilians in Iraq.
We have gone nowhere and are going nowhere as the electorate in the South have proven they don't SF in their Government. In fact these men and others have died to establish another conformist party willing to do anything to get into power.
They were brave men who died in vain, therefore we should learn from their sacrifice that violence will never achieve anything only a new generation of hypocritical politicians.

by YoungRepublican Fri Aug 22, 2008 21:24

It will be those like the Loughgall Martyrs that future generations will remember and revere.
They went out with honourable intentions that day, and met their deaths in the pursuit of Ireland's freedom. East Tyrone suffered horribly at the hands of the Brits and their proxies, and despite your laughable attempts to lump them together, the IRA were distinguished by obvious aims, sound theoretical justification, and a desire to create lasting change in Ireland.
How about you detractors take a closer look at the dead-end capitalistic Ireland that will be your lasting legacy?

by Tommy Sat Aug 30, 2008 00:06

I have read with interest many of the interesting comments made through this message board on the IRA men who died at the Loughgall ambush in 1987. Being of a certain vintage I remember that awful event and the accompaning gloating that it was met with by the the media. Everyone has his/her own take on the killings but in my opinion the men who died were brave soldiers who were on active service, and, who were shot down by the SAS in the cowardly fashion which is a trait of that regiment. A fair fight? Not a hope - the SAS men had received information from a traitor and they then lay in wait making sure that they had enough deadly force to wipe out any threat they might face. The 'brave' men of the SAS were to give a repeat performance in Gib the following year. I'm not complaining - the IRA were fighting a war in the six counties but why the British pretence that its forces abide or uphold the rule of law? None of these murderers ever have to reveal themselves in a court of law or explain the circumstances of their actions in firefights such as the one at Loughgall. It is easy for us today to sit and discuss these events and to make judgements about who was wrong and who was right. In my view there was never a fair fight, how could there be? consider the numbers of British soldiers, RUC, UDR, and loyalist murderers operating in the six counties not to mention MI5 and the SAS. Every IRA man/woman who has made a conscious decision to fight for an end to British Rule here has effectively thrown away his/her life. For most of them it was a life on the run, long prison terms, or, an early grave. As an ordinary Irish person I will always appreciate what these IRA men have done, I'm sorry for them and all their families and I know that these soldiers have entered the pantheon of Irish republicanism. The story of the modern troubles is one of human misery and tragedy all round and one hopes that the British have a genuine committment to the present peace arrangements. Let us hope that this peace process, which the British were steered towards by the actions of the IRA, will lead to a lasting and mutually acceptable settlement in the six counties.

by Damien M - PW Mon Oct 10, 2011 23:39

"Thankfully nobody has to die in Northern Ireland anymore."

True Mr McNab, you guys are conducting your resource wars elsewhere. A million dead in the Middle East in 10 glorious years, last I heard Mr Clegg was a paramedic out there-come a long way since shooting joyriders.