Belfast anti-war meeting on Shannon & Iraq war: Acquitted Pitstop Ploughshares to speak

by sp Thu Aug 24, 2006 17:38

who is involved in anti war ireland in belfast
i didnt see you at any of the recent lebanon protests

by Belfast AWI Thu Aug 24, 2006 17:47

Belfast AWI is only kicking off and has just a few members. We hope to launch a proper branch after this meeting. An organising meeting will be held in the unemployed centre the following Saturday and those interested are more than welcome to attend. Come to the public meeting for details.

As to visibility, the Belfast members have been on the streets repeatedly over the past period, handing out solidarity leaflets around the Pitstop Ploughshares trial and later in solidarity with the people of Lebanon and Palestine. Most of those leafleting sessions were advertised in advance on indymedia. You weren't there, obviously, but maybe you'll turn up next time.

Anti-War Ireland is active in Dublin, Cork, Belfast and Cobh. Check other threads on indymedia for reports on our activities.

by Wandering ps Fri Aug 25, 2006 12:58

"i didnt see you at any of the recent lebanon protests"

The objective conditions weren't right for that protest.

by Anti-War Ireland Sat Aug 26, 2006 21:31 info at antiwarireland dot org

Colm Breathnach of the Dublin branch of Anti-War Ireland has been confirmed as the third speaker for this public meeting.

by antiwar Mon Sep 11, 2006 10:26

The Dublin meeting with the acquitted ploiughshares was very although its unfortunate there wasn't more time for discussion. I think they're speaking alongside the Raytheon Nine in Derry tonight as well.

by antiwar Mon Sep 11, 2006 10:26

The Dublin meeting with the acquitted ploiughshares was very although its unfortunate there wasn't more time for discussion. I think they're speaking alongside the Raytheon Nine in Derry tonight as well.

by Belfast anti war Mon Sep 11, 2006 14:08

I had a look at the anti war ireland website in order to see what the difference between it and the IAWM is - I assume there are ideological differences. However, all it contains is details of meetings/activities.

Some people who I'm told are associated with AWI have given Belfast AWM - the local IAWM affiliate - a hard time for supporting the Hezbollah resistance in Lebanon. Would this be one of the major ideological differences? Is all this likely to be explained at tomorrow night's meeting in Belfast?

by antiwar irelander Mon Sep 11, 2006 15:09

You: "I had a look at the anti war ireland website in order to see what the difference between it and the IAWM is - I assume there are ideological differences. However, all it contains is details of meetings/activities. "

The differences are partly ideological, but also to do with democratic structures and behaviour. The IAWM is a creature of the SWP and its behaviour within the IAWM has pissed off and appalled many anti-war activists. However, let's be clear about this, AWI is NOT some sort of disgruntled split from the IAWM. It's a completely separate initiative. The IAWM in Dublin is very small (as are all the anti-war groups) and it scarcely exists anywhere else in the country. It's badly misnamed, as I'm sure you'll agree.

Unlike the IAWM, Anti-War Ireland believes in deploying a diversity of tactics from mass demonstrations, rallies and pickets to civil disobedience and direct action.

AWI is also a democratic organisation and is committed to participatory structures within the organisation - for example there is no top-down 'steering committee' with an immovable chairperson. With regard to policies, the organisation has really only expanded in the past two or three months - it is building and recruiting very quickly, though - and it is at national meetings that policies will be decided. We expect to have a national meeting in November. That said, AWI is not a political party and, so, don't be expecting prescriptive 50-page policy documents on every single issue.

You: "Some people who I'm told are associated with AWI have given Belfast AWM - the local IAWM affiliate - a hard time for supporting the Hezbollah resistance in Lebanon. "

Dunno who these people are. AWI is committed to constructive cooperation with other anti-war groups and isn't into rivalry or competition. However, you are partly correct about Hezbollah. AWI does not believe that my enemy's enemy is necessarily my friend. We don't back the Iranian government against the Bush regime, for instance; we back the Iranian people. There are a variety of views within AWI on Hezbollah.

"Would this be one of the major ideological differences? Is all this likely to be explained at tomorrow night's meeting in Belfast?"

Yes, all will be explained at the meeting. Attend, listen and debate if you disagree.

Above all, we want to work constructively with other anti-war groups, so try to focus on the shared objectives rather than the differences. Conflict within the anti-war movement serves no useful purpose.

by confused Mon Sep 11, 2006 15:39

What's the IAWM's "ideological position" on Hizbullah? Is there a party line? I'm guessing it's exactly that taken by the SWP. Any takers?

by Dublin anti-war Mon Sep 11, 2006 16:00

AWI it "is building and recruiting" says antiwar irelander. True, but people should bear in mind that we are interested in 'activists' - not passive 'members' recruited to bumpf up our finances.

by Belfast Anti War Mon Sep 11, 2006 18:06

"AWI does not believe that my enemy's enemy is necessarily my friend. We don't back the Iranian government against the Bush regime, for instance; we back the Iranian people." This sounds great until you realise that it's the Iranian people who will die if Bush attacks Iran and that the Iranian people - even those who are its most vehement opponents - back its government against the Bush regime. Anti imperialists here in Ireland, North or South, cannot adopt this "We don't back the Iranian government against the Bush regime, for instance; we back the Iranian people" approach. The Socialist Party have prevaricated and failed to take an anti-imperialist position for years now by using this kind of nonsensical rhetoric. It's sad to see anarchists now spouting it.

Personally, I think you have to decide which side you're on: Bush or Iran's.

by AWI member Mon Sep 11, 2006 19:00

"This sounds great until you realise that it's the Iranian people who will die if Bush attacks Iran and that the Iranian people - even those who are its most vehement opponents - back its government against the Bush regime. Anti imperialists here in Ireland, North or South, cannot adopt this"

Really? Anti-War Ireland has made it very clear that it's strongly anti-imperialist in its political outlook. That's why it's a 32-county organisation and not affiliated in the six counties to the British Stop the War Coalition. To say that Iranian people all back their government against Bush is meaningless - and not true either. Many Iranian revolutionaries and socialists who are vehemently opposed to Bush and US threats are equally critical of their theocratic repressive government. It is possible to oppose imperialism, as principled left-wingers, and to argue for a better internal political system. Do you, for example, want to endorse a government that violently oppresses women, gays and minorities? Nobody in Europe should buttress illusions about the conservative regime that currently runs Iran. And this doesn't mean that you undermine those opposing imperialism, like certain left-wing groups did in Ireland.

"The Socialist Party have prevaricated and failed to take an anti-imperialist position for years now by using this kind of nonsensical rhetoric. It's sad to see anarchists now spouting it."

I don't know what you're on about here. AWI has anarchist members, but lots of others also from socialists to republicans. AWI is anti-imperialist is a genuine sense: we support the destruction of imperial war machines. None of that, however, should cause us to blind ourselves to reactionary regimes. It's all very well for us in Ireland to shout 'Up the Iranian government!' An easy thing to do and it fits neatly with western models of fighting imperialism. However, in Iran, to shout 'Up the government!' means supporting a rotten oppressive anti-woman, anti-gay, anti-socialist regime. Iranian socialists oppose US threats, but not by sowing illusions about reactionaries.

"Personally, I think you have to decide which side you're on: Bush or Iran's."

For a start, Bush is an individual; Iran is a country. What's the dichotomy here? Bush is emblematic of a neo-conservative movement that has a vice-like grip on Washington at the moment - it is a movement that, to the surprise of many (Francis Fukuyama, for instance) took to foreign interventionism and imperial conquest like a duck to water. It's a movement that must be stopped, but US imperialism is ultimately a bigger problem linked to capitalism. The armed resistance stopped it in Vietnam and the resistance in Iraq, which is a mixture of tendencies (some utterly reactionary; others secular-nationalist; some left-wing), is causing US imperialism serious problems now. Our job is undermine our own country's complicity with the US murder machine. So, yeah, let's oppose the Bush regime and all it represents.

What does 'Iran' mean? If you mean the Iranian people, the working class, the peasantry, etc. etc., then we're with you. If you equate the country with the present regime, then nah, we're not in the business of pretending that it's anything other than repressive and reactionary. So, we support Iran - by which we mean its people - not the government. What's the issue with that? Seems sensible to me. Otherwise, you're talking so black and white that you end up cheerleading a regime that oppresses significant sectors of Iranian society!

Not everything can be encapsulated in snappy 'either or' slogans.

by Republican Mon Sep 11, 2006 20:46

I don't know if 'Belfast anti-war' is a republican or Trotskyist or what, but the Anti-War Ireland position bears no relation to the Militant / Socialist Party line on the north. The SP believe(d) in a socialist NI federated to a socialist Britain and slammed anti-imperialist movements. It was a disgraceful attitude to communities engaged in anti-imperialist struggle.

There is no comparison between the reactionary Iran government and oppositional anti-imperialist group like the INLA and the IRA.

by anon Tue Sep 12, 2006 12:09

The most important thing imho about Anti-War Ireland is that it is genuinely democratic and the members make the decisions collectively. That doesn't mean that we agree with each other all the time on every issue coz we don't, but it would be downright weird if we did.

If people want to help in the campaign to demilitarise Shannon airport and end Irish complicity, then get involved. The more members, the more effective AWI will be.

by fred - inquiring minds Tue Sep 12, 2006 17:39

there seems to be only two of the ploughshares ? what did they do with the others?
if there are only two, does that mean that they still speak for the others or does the group exist at all?

by Fintan Lane - Anti-war Ireland (Dublin) Tue Sep 12, 2006 17:57 info at antiwarireland dot org

The other three members of the group formerly known as the Pitstop Ploughshares have either left the country or will soon. The Pitstop Ploughshares existed as a group for this specific action alone - as in all previous Ploughshares' actions - and with the conclusion of the legal proceedings, the group dissolved.

Deirdre is speaking on behalf of Anti-War Ireland and, in an individual capacity, as an acquitted member of the Pitstop Ploughshares.

Ciaron is a long-standing Ploughshares' activist and member of the Catholic Worker Movement. Again, with regard to the Pitstop Ploughshares, he speaks for nobody other than himself as an individual acquitted Ploughshares activist.

Nuin, Karen and Damien are well able to speak for themselves.

by fred Tue Sep 12, 2006 18:00

thanx for that info. i was a bit confused.

by Ciarán Ó Brolcháin Tue Sep 12, 2006 18:43

sp wrote: "who is involved in anti war ireland in belfast
i didnt see you at any of the recent lebanon protests"

Perhaps they were there in a personal capacity?

by attendee Wed Sep 13, 2006 00:45

Meeting was full and very good. Definitely one of the most interesting antiwar meetings I've been at for a long time. Fair play to the organisers. Serious outfit.

by Davy Carlin - Organise! Wed Sep 13, 2006 11:11

Firstly SP

Quote -who is involved in anti war ireland in belfast
i didnt see you at any of the recent lebanon protests

You may have seen a tall dark good looking fella at all of them, and spoke at one

I am involved in AWI!!!

Brief report of meeting and launch

The Belfast launch of the AWI Belfast branch kicked of in good style. A broad meeting of 35 activists from different groups {and none} attended the meeting. Chaired by myself {Organise! and AWI organising group} it opened up with Ciaron speaking, then followed Deirdre, both gave excellent accounts of both the recent Pitstop Ploughshares struggle as well as given an International analysis.

They also called for support as did all speakers for the Raytheon 9. Colm gave an account of his time in Palestine as well as what Anti War Ireland was about. He also called for support for the upcoming National demo

It was opened up to the floor and issues ranging from British Imperialism and US Imperialism right through to the issue of Iran and the tactics of Direct Action, Civil Disobedience and Mass mobilisation was discussed, this amongst many other issues. Almost all who attended left details fro further involvement.

Given this was the first meeting and launch of the Belfast AWI it was an excellent start and would be equivalent of over 100 activists turning up to a new launch in Dublin. I personally had found the speakers very articulate and very knowledgeable and had seen good intervention from the floor.

On a personal note the third and final part of my articles on the History of the Belfast Anti War Movement will be up on the Blanket soon and should answer many of the questions I have been asked about such. – as will that of the final article on the History of ARN Movement and then that of the History of MPH Movement in the North ATB -D

by Ciaron O'Reilly - Dublin Catholic Worker/Pit Stop Ploughshares (personal capac Wed Sep 13, 2006 20:01

Q.What is a pitstop or a pit stop?
A.(As Abbie Hoffman said when accused by the prosecutor of conspiracy with the rest of the Chicago 8 "We couldn't agree on lunch!" Well we couldn't agree on the spelling!)
A pit stop is a refeuling area in a Grand Prix. Shannon is pitstop/refueling area in an illegal immoral unwinnable war!

Q What is a ploughshare?
A. A ploughshares is a farming implement to turn the soil.

Q.What is "swords into ploughshares"?
A. It's a 3,000 year old Jewish prophecy that apears in Isaih chapter 2 and Micah chapter 4

Q. What is the ploughsares/plowshares movement.
A. A ploughshares action is an act of faithbased pacifist nonviolent disarmament.
The plowshares movement began on Sept 9th. 1980 when 8 faithbased anti-war activists went into General Electrics plant in the town of "King of Prussia" (see the movie starring Martin Sheen as the Judge, defendants playing themselves) and hammered on first strike nuclear weapon delivery systems.

Since 1980, there has been over 100 of these actions see chronology section of www.plowsharesactions.org

Q. What was the Pit Stop Ploughshares?
A community which came together to disarm at Shannon Airport and resist the war on Iraq and irish complicity in that war . The community concluded with the acquittal at the Four Courts. (Stay tuned for the "Would You Believe" tv doc on Damien Moran, should go to air RTE October and for a book coming out by a local Dublin journalist, sorry all out of t-shirts have sold out, still have a website www.peaceontrial.com )

Each plowshares community adopts a name. This has been my third plowshares action on my third continent (wait for peace march of penguins coming soon!) The first one was the ANZUS Plowshares (named after a military alliance between Australia, New Zealand and United States from which the community members sprung! A treaty suspended whrn New Zealand refused to allow nuclear ships into their harbours in '84. The second one was Jabiluka Plougshares named after the urnaium mine site where we acted. Some communities name themsleves after weapon systems (Trident, B52, Pershing etc), some after feast days (Good Friday, Advent etc) some after concepts (Seeds of Hope, Weep for the Children, etc). Joan Baez said we (PSP) had "the grooviest name she had heard for a while", so there you go!

Allmy codefendants fomr previous actions are still active resisting the war machine!

Q. Where did the movement come from?
A. Roughly. The movement grew out of the resistance known as the "Catholic Left" or ultrareistsance or draft board raiders in the late 60's early '70's in the U.S. to the war in Vietnam. The formation of Jonah House reistance community by Phil Berrigan & Liz Mcalister and others was significantin post-Vietnam nonviolent faithbased reistance in the U.S. www.jonahhouse.org

Over half the people who have done plowshares action in the U.S. have spent a year living and working witht he homeless in a Catholic Worker hospitality houses. Many others come from work andliving with the poor in the 3rd. world...home to confront the empire. Quite a few have been military veterans (WW2, Vietnam) and also priests, nuns, religious brothers.

The Catholic Worker movement begun by Dorothy day in 1933 had a consientious objection position and many of the young men were imprisoned in WW2 for draft resistance. CW's were the first to burn their draft cards publicly at the beginning of the Vietnam War. Dan and Phil Berrigan had a big influence on the CW movement moving form a passive CO position to a more assertive nonviolent resistance. (see Catonsville 9 draft board raid Maryland USA 1968 as significant)

Q. What are disarmament actions?
A. Inspired by the plowshares actions by faith based pacifists. In 1980's other folks who did not identify with the prophecy or a faith base carried out disarmament actions eg. Katya Komisarack ("White Rose Conspiracy") at Vanderburg AFB on Navstar, Earth Firsters on a Navstar sattelite in a clean room (they had getaway car and false passports and intentions to head for the Mexican border (made it to the sattelite, didn't make it to Mexico)

Q. What are these meetings?
Deirdre and I remain in Ireland. deirdre has joined AWI, I haven't. I think AWI is a great development.I'm living at the Catholic Worker residence. We are both open to speaking about our experiences in the Pit Stop Plougshares and sharing those experiences for people considering nonviolent resistance to this war.