Celebrating 1916

by Barry - 32 csm Tue Apr 11, 2006 13:26

"I would not wish to die for some mystical idea.
Neither would thousands of my fellow countrymen"

National independence and sovereignty isnt a mystical idea . Its pretty much a right every nation clings to dearly . Generally speaking people dont wish to die for anything at all . They do however tend to wish to live in a dignified mannwer ie with their country and political system and not dominated by a foreign colonial power .

by Barry - 32csm Tue Apr 11, 2006 13:23

I think youll find you are wrong in basically every word youve written . The right to a nations sovereignty and to rule ourselves as opposed to being ruled by a foreign power is more than paint and flags . Only an idiot believes national sovereignty and self etermination boils down to symbols .
I think youll find many 1000s of your countrymen and women will remember 1916 in a variety of ways . Otherwise the state simply wouldnt be attempting to monopolise the event .

by Pacifist Tue Apr 11, 2006 12:57

Irish Independence could have been won peacefully.

In fact it was certainty that the Irish nationalists in the Commons who push through Home Rule.
After that full independence could have been gradually implemented.

De Valera gradually undermined Irish links to the Crown paving the way for the Irish Republic in 1948.

The IRA campaign in Northern Ireland has achieved nothing.
Northern Ireland remains part of the UK and will remain so until the the majority of the people of Northern Ireland vote to join the Republic. Sinn Fein will never realise the goal of a united Ireland until they realise that.
As long as the Unionists remain the majority and indeed large minority any fool hardy attempt to unify Ireland could result in civil war.

A United Ireland is not important anyway.

Honestly what difference does it make what flag is fluttering over public buildings or what color the post boxes are painted.

I would not wish to die for some mystical idea.
Neither would thousands of my fellow countrymen.

1916 is no longer relevant and no longer worthy of commeration

by blaise Mon Apr 10, 2006 21:02

we were defending ourselves from the evil invaders/colonists. It was/is a war brought upon us. We are not colonists. We do not subjugate other nations to our laws. Sure, who doesn't like war - only war mongers - but sometimes you have to - to simply defend yourself from infidels - as the British can be....

by Pacifist Mon Apr 10, 2006 18:19

1916 should be remembered for only one thing - the indiscriminate slaughter of hundreds of starving innocent men women and children who died in the hail of gunfire, fire and rubble of the city centre as they foraged for food while the rebels and the Crown forces fought it out within a heavilty populated urban area with total disregard because of military necessity for the lethal danger to the innocent inhabitants.
The events of 1916 were not glorious and the violence should not be commerated.
What should be commerated are the dead on all sides especially the innocent who were the majority of the dead.
The War of Independence and the Civil War were hardly glorious either.
Neither were the Troubles.
We should remember the dead.

In World War I, Germany, Austria-Hungary and the Ottomon empire consumed by a lust for global supremacy tried to steal territory from France, Britain and Russia who were consumed by the desire to hold onto what they had stolen.
To prevent the Central Powers from conquering the world millions of French, British and Russians men gave their lives and took millions of Germans, Austrians and Turks with them. I not believe that either side in that ghastly war had any moral superiority.
It should be remembered as a tragedy utterly devoid of glory.

Nazi Germany, Italy and Japan thought they could carve up the world between them and they overthrown by the USSR, USA and the British Common Wealth and the occupied peoples of Europe and Asia. Millions of soldiers died on all sides but the majority of the millions who perished were innocent civilians. The defeat of fascism was utterly vital but the there was nothing glorious in World War 2 only profound shame that such madness occured and that the Allies to lose so many of their own countrymen and had to slaughter so many Germans, Italians and Japanese to do it.

The Cold War struggle between the USSR and USA led to the deaths of millions of innocents throughout the world either where their militaries intervened in Vietnam in the case of the US or Afghanistan in the case of the USSR and throughout the world as nations were used by the superpowers as pawns to fight ideological struggle. There is nothing glorious about the colossal waste of money in nuclear arms build ups while millions died of famines.

The current War on Terror aims to defeat Islamic fundementalist and save the Western world and the Middle East from barbarism - supposing for argument sake that Bush and Blair are right - but before it is resolved millions will surely die. There will be more Iraq style wars and more 9/11 style attacks. That will not be glorious.

Some wars are justified of course. Most wars are not.

But none should be commerated.

Remember the dead.

I reject the glorification of the 1916 and all wars.
And I believe it is morally wrong to do so.