Boycott Ryanair

by ryanair fan Thu Feb 24, 2005 11:06

Ryainair according to RTE will create 2,500 jobs for this deal with the Seattle based aircraft company.
What's wrong with you? You against jobs in your precious "cradle of revolution" Seattle?

by Devil's advocate Thu Feb 24, 2005 11:06

What other options are there? Aer Lingus? Yeh, ask anyone and they'll tell you how Aer Lingus management love unions. No company likes unions, 'cept if they are unions which they can control.

Passengers don't decide what aircraft they fly in -- it could be a boeing or an airbus. If Boeing weren't doing such terrible business (they almost went bust two times in the 90s) the US government maybe wouldn't have to bail them out with all those phoney military aviation contracts (like warplanes that only work when it's not raining!).

Sure, if you're gonna boycott Ryanair you've got to boycott just about every other company in Ireland of any size for all of the reasons you listed. Good luck shopping for food! :-)

by mcjobs with wings and vizors and cross hairs - the pamphlet crew. Thu Feb 24, 2005 11:16

Boeing between 2003 and 2004 cut over 70,000 jobs in Seattle and progressively non-unionised their workforce playing havoc with the economics of both city and state, during the Boeing crises the then mayor was almost moved to suggest a federal take-over.

The 2,500 jobs which will be created by Ryanair's deal could have gone to europeans. As the authorities in Seattle could have changed the economic profile of their city.

Ryanair has for too long hid behind "we create jobs" slogan. Each new flight path is vaunted as creating between 200 and 400 jobs, yet as with most Ryanair propaganda and figures is not open to scrutiny.

Is a flight attendent perhaps like some modern day Padre Pio who may be employed in bilocation?

The Ryanair approach to job creation and job security is not dissimilar to a burger chain or drawing the parallel to Seattle a coffee chain.

They are the mcjobs of the air industry. Ryanair grumble the most at airport charges, at upholding or respecting union decisions in other states of the EU. They make the smallest recorded "corporate good will" donations to the environment, or any other charities. Yet their industry contaminates the environment, atmosphere and there's aucustic pollution to give an ear too.

Their advertising has been consistently fraudelent.

And now they're on page one the Boeing Corporation Site-
http://boeing.com/flash.html
and here's the confirmation of the news.
http://www.boeing.com/news/breakingnews/2005/050224g.html

by Rock Hudson Thu Feb 24, 2005 11:24

"Its tawdy treatment of disabled passengers."

I can't disagree with you there but I'm not going to be fleeced by Aer Lingus when I want to get to old Trafford because the match tickets and the hotel room cost enough already.

"Its poor worker relations in other countries and preference for non-unionised workforces."

I wouldn't work for Ryanair because I wouldn't work for MacDonald's either but unionised workers in Aer Lingus demanding higher wages push up the price of Aer Lingus airfares. Non unionised workers in Ryanair mean low running costs and low airfares for customers. Lowfares are what I want.

"It's current struggle with the Irish Airline Pilots Association."

If pilots strike Aer Lingus caves into their demands whereas Ryanair have the balls to face them down. If that keeps planes in the air and I can get a cheap flight then I would fly Ryanair.

"Again and Again it has proved to be "the unacceptable face of capitalism".

Their bullies but they get me from A to B cheaper than anyone else. That's acceptable.


This morning Ryanair will close a deal with Boeing to purchase at a cost 4.5billion€ a fleet of aircraft.
Thus proving a clear commitment to the arms industry, war economy and utter disloyalty to the European project.
There are aircraft available which are made in Europe by European workers, the purchase of which would help guarantee the European industry.

"Ryanair are a private company not a state owned company. The chief executive makes the day to day decisions not some pen pushing bureaucrat in Brussels.
If Ryanair can get a better deal with American Boeing than European Airbus are you suggesting that Ryanair be forced to buy Airbus. Imagine If you wanted buy a high quality Sony flat widescreen TV would you pay more just to keep the salesman happy or would you look for the best price around?

"Furthermore from the smallest manufactureres to the largest (airbus) the links to the arms industry and war economy are not so blatant as with Boeing."

The U.S. military use a version of the 747 as a troop transporter
China ordering scores of the new Airbus jumbos to transport their troops.
But anyway this irrelevant.
Why don't you complain to the local Toyota dealer that 4x4 Land Cruisers are used in third world countries as military jeeps armed with machine guns?

We don't live in a perfect world.
But at least Ryanair give cheap flights.

by Reality Check Thu Feb 24, 2005 14:25

If you did any research, you would find that the Ryan family are amongst the most generous in charity donation in Ireland - they just don't do it through the company. Michael O'Leary has also made incredibly generous gestures in a personal capacity.
As for the point that these jobs could have been for Europeans - how exactly is that relevant.
Why is 2,500 jobs in France any better than 2,500 jobs in Seattle. Do you hate America that much that you begrudge ordinary people work?

by kerry Thu Feb 24, 2005 17:34

i'm sure Micheal O Leary is, as we speak, changing his entire company because someone has posted such a scary threat on indymedia.ie.

I'm convinced he is running scared because of the power this post holds.

Cheap flights=customers.

No matter how many times you post on websites.

by Hag Thu Feb 24, 2005 21:54

Boycott all airlines. How much fuel do they use? How much pollution do planes streak through the sky? How many miles of land are tarmacced for them to land on?
It's stupid to whine about one airline, as if the rest of them weren't all having the same effect. Or can no one remember that we haven't always had plane-rides?

by :-) Fri Feb 25, 2005 01:38

it pollutes the upper atmosphere, the pollution caused by one flight is more than a days normal commuting traffic by car.
air traffic is noisy.
air traffic is dangerous.
air traffic provides a quick and easy way for people to get from A to B and be a drunken, drugged up nuisance at B and get back to A where they're generally more well behaved.
and this is it. Ryanairs contribution to the european project has been to facilitate the ease with which hooligans can get from A to B, forget all that crap about nuns, and distant family members, what is going on is moving consumers of capitalist society from areas where the weather is shite to other areas where its warmer, where the girls and boys are prettier, the whores cheaper and more interesting, drugs are better and and things are cheap.
Ryanair in ancient rome would have been called Visigothair or easyVandal. Don't even pretend for a minute that the majority of budget airline (or executive airtraffic) passengers _really need_ to go where they go. Its all shite. utter utter crap.
think about it.
back in the old days, oh yes, the old days, you hitch-hiked. or stowed away on a boat. or joined the navy. Now you just pay your tax to the government and go fuck up the fabric of another city and country, "thinking your european coz you're drinking milky coffee on a terrassa" and trying to get shagged. And somehow not getting shagged, not getting the footie results you wanted, and not really liking it. And spending your euros in a zone where your euros are worth more than at home and the workers do the same shite as at home and for the same pittance but you feel rich-
and coming back complaining...
oh the food is greasy, the girls and boys are too catholic and won't shag me I ended up getting head from a chelsea fan, all you get is a boiled sweet, its not so hot really, they're not friendly, and no i didn't send postcards or visit an art gallery.
OR-
I loved it it's really cheap, I'm going to buy a retirement / shag pad, coz its really cheap and i don't give a fuck if the people from there can't afford to live in the real estate speculation i fuel by paying over the odds for a room / flat / mortgage, its pretty and picturesque and a month later I'll complain bitterly about century old traditions coz they're not what i'm paying for, and why don't they speak my language¿?

OR- I signed the really important capitalist deal with the man and woman themselves instead of just blathering shite at them over the videoconference and managed to use more fuel than an african city needs for a day to come back feeling proud of myself.


COP ON.

is all this really worth the atmospheric planetary damage and cultural homogenous shite and mc jobs at A and at B?

NO IT ISN'T.
BASTA!

by visigothair Fri Feb 25, 2005 19:26

or 24hr porn.

writing is on the wall.

by i mac d - "nemesis" Fri Mar 04, 2005 12:58

No doubt this message will get through the airwaves & grapevines-

In this last week you have yet again found your company which boasts an irish logo and image,
and prides itself on being a product of the "celtic tiger" in the news for fraudelent advertising
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/7067490/
just after you manipulated yet again your potential for job creation in the deal you signed with BOIENG the US aerospace and arms industry corporation. (see above)

Today your stock moved from "neutral" to "overweight", this means that today and in the forthcoming week, short to medium term investors are going to bail out of your company.
http://www.newratings.com/new2/beta/article_717985.html

My Challenge is this-

Stop leafleting my local street with rubbish, tempting us to buy flights to Dublin for 1€ from BCN when we know the airport is in the next province. And start offering us flights which are cheap, but where a percentage of the cost goes to the provision of vaccines to the third world. I seem to remember during the annual joke of the WEF in Davos this year, Chirac making the very real suggestion of levying airlines with a flat tax to assist the ending of global poverty. & this makes moral sense.

More moral sense than pretending sister Kathleen of Glasgow was your millionth customer (which she wasn't) and giving her 100,000€ which as you know equalled the vatican donation to the good samaritan fund the very next banking day.

More moral sense than opening new routes shouting about job creation when you fire union reps before you take over and drop the working conditions-
http://www.indymedia.ie/newswire.php?story_id=68282

More moral sense than entering law suits which you lose with disabled passengers-
http://www.indymedia.ie/newswire.php?story_id=61322

It makes sense, because you are a part of globalisation. And many of us think "a dangerous part". More money is spent by our states and tax payers on monitoring your traffic and passengers in the name of security than on ports. More cultural and speculative real estate damage is done to the poorer regions of the EU in the name of your profits than by local investors. More desieses are spread by your airline and its "peers" more quickly than by any other form of transport.

So the challenge is this-
rather than leading your sector and influencing the airline alliances and state providors by provocative competition and quite frankly unacceptably greedy capitalist practise,-

"LEAD BY EXAMPLE".

"Try and earn that Harp you so blythely fly, Mr O' Leary, become part of the new Europe, & stop using that line on your website
"Where we going-
Like Superman, we're going UP, UP, UP and AWAY.·" Coz Mr O leary, you know what happened to Superman don't you?

Make a decent donation from every flight cost to a recognised and guaranteed donation fund to providing Vaccines / Clean Water / Education to the Third world. And then we'll start going easier on you. But you're in the really bad books Mr O Leary.

by xi Tue Mar 08, 2005 08:24

CEO of BOEING has gone
coz he had an affair with a female executive
breaking their company code.

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/virgin/214879_virgin08.html
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/business/214916_ethics08.html
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/business/214925_replacements08.html

Do Ryanair have such a code?

by 12 Tue Mar 22, 2005 12:42

A court in Belgium has ruled that Irish airline Ryanair infringed local labour laws when it dismissed three Belgian employees in 2002.
The company had unsuccessfully argued that the three were hired on Irish contracts and their sacking after a one-year trial period was legal under Irish law.
Under Belgian law, workers only have to undertake a six-month trial period before they have full job protection.
Ryanair had argued that the three signed contracts drawn up in Dublin and worked on planes registered in Ireland, but the Belgian courts said they were working at the airline's Charleroi hub and were therefore entitled to the protection of Belgian law.
***********
This is not the only case of Ryanair abusing local labour working rights, in the cause of "visigoth air" Ryanair routinely purges unionised workforce as undesirables. And true to the capitalist ethics of greed, Ryanair pays the lowest it can to everyone for everything. There has been no indication from Ryanair that wish to take up the ethical practise challenge, and make declared contributions to vaccines and the environment.
(they probably don't take it seriously - coz their CEO is superman)

by Marlene Fri Apr 01, 2005 19:46 marlene_hotz at hotmail dot com 01252 721741

I did not like some of the comments that more or less said I don't care as long as it's cheap. A big part of the problem with todays society is that principles have gone out of the window. O'Learys treatment of disable people has been uttlerly disgraceful. He is just a capitalist pig.

by Devil Dog Fri Apr 01, 2005 20:18

He is just a very successful businessman....I love the way the term "capitalist" is bandied around like an insult....I don't see the Irish electorate falling over themselves to introduce some socialist workers' paradise...and Marlene, do you fly? And if so, would you rather drop 200 quid for a flight from Dublin to London on some inefficiient, state-subsidised dinosaur airline which exists for the benefir of its workforce, not its customers or would you rather fly Ryanair?

by a furious passenger Wed Apr 06, 2005 15:45

ryanair sucks , they treat passengers like crap....and if you don`t flight on certain days you end up paying as much as you would pay with Emirates !!!

michael o`leary is the most arrogant , ignorant piece of shit that ever existed....and he calls himself "CEO".....

by spiderman Thu Apr 21, 2005 23:28

in connection to the breaching of a court order last year by his company. This forms part of an ongoing problem with badly treated pilots, who though not exactly precarious, or vote winners for us manipulators of the [we've coined a new word] precaritous classes, they are though highly trained professionals who are entrusted in a key transport sector with the safe conveyance of numerous living people termed passengers, and if they go black market lots of drugs.
This is a very serious job. And just like prison officers its the sort of job that attracts a certain psychological profile. It is still uncertain whether Mr O Leary will go to prison in ireland before the new private partnership proposals of mcdowell are pushed through the legislature, so no-one is breaking a leg on this at the bookies.
But it's a positive case of shadenfreude that merited the national telly station of Ireland's 9 o'clock bulletin all the same, putting old benedict continuity 16 back a few minutes.

by Lipjam - None Tue Jan 15, 2008 01:29 lipjam at gmail dot com

The ethos of Ryan Air is basically the one of Naziism .Survival of the fittest. Promotion of the strong, the fit and the neglect and abuse of the weak. The whole push of cheap flights is a myth. Ryan air when you add taxes and charges may work out €10-€20 cheaper than the competition but you get what you pay for. They have no regard for their customers... they are only concerned about profit margins. They are the epitome of everything that is wrong with modern society. "Greed is good"

Just because something is cheap does not mean you are making a saving. There is always a price to be paid. Whether it is exploitation of children in sweat shops in India or airport workers in Belgium. The price has to be paid by someone. Ryan Air is a blight on everything that is good about humanity. It place profits above humanity. It seeks the immediate benefit above the the greater good. It states that it is only supplying what people want, well drug dealers make the same argument.

I urge you to stop and think what you are giving your hard earned money to. O'leary is the face of ryan air, and what an ugly face it is: conceited, self indulgent, rude, arrogant, greedy, indifferent. Is this what we want to promote? Yet people make the argument that it is cheap so they will continue to buy. St. Thomas Moore once said that what would happen if he neglected one law to indict the devil? If the devil overcame that one would he sacrifice another, and another, and yet another until having erased every protection of the Law he was left standing naked, then the devil turned on him. What could he do? I am not saying o'leary is the devil I woudn't insult the devil. He is just a sad selfish man, but he has been put in a dangerous position, and it is we who have put him there. People like him have rsien to power on our backs and use that power to abuse those in a less fortunate position.

Is that what we want to promote? Is that what we aspire to? Where your treasure is there your heart will be also. Do not give to an unworthy cause. The old adage rings true: If it seems to good to be true it usually is. Ryan Air is not a good deal... it is a con!

by wordsmith Tue Jan 15, 2008 05:21

Many of your points about Ryanair staff gruffly treating passengers (they're under pressure "to produce" from their bosses, so manners go out the window sometimes) and playing games with transnational staff salary deals are much to the point.

Why then bring in the old swear language about naziism and nazi practices? It trivialises what the nazis did and contributes nothing except hyper-invective to your post.

Ryanair at the beginning broke up the cosy cartel atmosphere that enabled monopoly holders British Airways and Aer Lingus to charge extortionate ticket prices for the Dublin-London and other frequent routes. It helped Knock Airport to get commercially launched by putting on cheaper flights to Stanstead, Leeds, Glasgow and elsewhere, thereby making air holiday flights an option for Irish emigrant working class families. It made regional airports in UK and Europe accessible as alternative destinations for business and holiday travellers.

by Lipjam - None Tue Jan 15, 2008 20:39

Dear Wordsmith

I said nothing about the staff of Ryan air. I made the point abut Ryan Air as a company and what it has achieved. Of course there are positives that can be demonstrated, but who is to say this would not have happened anyway. The benefits of Knock and the lowering of air ticket prices has more to do with deregulation then it has to do with Ryan Air. O'leary simply took advantage of these developments. I have flown with Ryan Air several times and I have seen first hand the mad rush of people to get on the plane and get off. The simple allocating of seats would eliminate this pushing and shoving but it isn't cost effective for Ryan Air so they don't.

They regularly over book their flights to ensure all seats are taken up and then make pathetic excuses in order to weed out exceess passengers. They treat their staff and passengers with equal contempt. They over work their staff and over stress their passengers, because it is more cost effective to do this than to make an effort to satisfy either. They can charge an excess with ease but when you are due a refund they make it as difficult as possible. How many passengers have had their airport charges illegally withheld when they have not flown or been refused admittance to their flights.

I have had personal experience of being refused admittance at the boarding gate, on the pretense that my passport number did not match the number on the check-in slip when I had already been checked in, by Rayn air. This was because I had used my driver's license which I produced at the gate but this made no difference, I was only on a flight from Ireland to the UK and I am an Irish citizen. This was Ryan air's fault but I spent 14 hours in Dublin Airport because of their actions. I received no apology or any effort to make alternative arrangements. While in Dublin airport I saw Ryan Air cancel flight after flight in quick succession rather than transfer it's passengers because they would receive all those airport taxes, which is the loins share of the price they charge their passengers. I saw Aer lingus making every effort to transfer their passengers while Ryan Air passenger simply had to re-book at extortionate prices. I am not saying that Aer Lingus or British Airways are not without blame but there sins pale in comparison to Ryan Air. They are the ugly face of capitalism, and they make no apology for it.

I know staff are under pressure and I do not blame them. They are told what to do and say and there is no room for accommodation. Women with children, the elderly, the handicapped are seen as a hassle. I saw O'leary on the news blame the wheelchair bound for his decision to increase charges because a British court found their charges on the disabled illegal. If you find my allusion to Naziism distasteful, I agree but it still holds. I did not liken them to the Nazis or their crimes. Nor did I seek to belittle the crimes of the Nazis or disrespect their victims. I made the comparison about the ethos of the Nazis which comes from Darwinism, and Eugenics: the survival of the fittest, at the expense of the weak. The reason I made the comparison is to highlight that Ryan Air if left unfettered would pursue this ethos as long as it is economically viable to do so. We have seen this in the past. They do not change their policy for the sake of their passengers, or because it is the right thing to do, but because they are forced to do so by the courts or Governments, or the EU. As a company they have never done anything for the sake of their passengers... simply for the all important profit margins. I know they are not alone in this as a company but they are certainly the most unapologetic.

They are symptom of where our society is going, and we all have a part to play in this. You pay your money and you take your seat. We might be saving a little but the price will be paid, by others, maybe our children? I am not simply talking about airline tickets. We have a duty to see that what is good about our society is passed onto our children, and Ryan Air does not in anyway reflect these values. Would you give your money to an organisation that devalues human beings by reducing them to transactions? Ryan passengers are herded on to flights and then herded off, with no regard for their peace of mind. Flights are turned around with alarming speed, placing their staff under increasing stress. These are not accidents, they are deliberate policy decisions. I do not want to be treated like a number, and I do not want to see my children devalued in any way or told that this is an acceptable way to treat others. Nor will I give my money to any one that seeks to do so. All I asking is that others do the same. Ryan air owes its success to you and me and we give it its power. O'leary seems to be oblivious to this, so we need to remind him. All that is needed that evil succeed is that good men do nothing. I have decided to pay the price now because it is important, and the price later... may be too much?

by aristotle Tue Jan 15, 2008 21:31

Dear Lipjam,

The bottom line is that you were careless in completing your documentation and because Ryanair refused to make an exception for such an obviously self-important person as you, you are very pissed off. Tough.

Ryanair would not be successful if millions of Europeans did not freely opt to travel with them. With Ryanair, what you see is what you get. The rules and requirements for flying with FR are clear and pretty simple. Its website is user-friendly, and unlike that of Aerfungus, it doesn't mislead users as to the cost of flights.

When I was a student many years ago air-travel from Ireland was held in a throttle-like grip by state monopoly Aerfungus (in a ticket-sharing cartel with its British counterpart, BA). Choice was limited to about five European destinations (in addition to the Shannon based transatlantic routes to Kennedy and Logan). Return trips were effectively compulsory, as were Saturday-night stopovers. Flying from Ireland to Britain or mainland Europe cost two weeks wages for someone on the national average. The airlines were run for the benefits of the employees who had such perks as free flights.

Ryanair changed everything. Ryanair provided what the customer wanted. Aerfungus, if it wishes to survive will have to compete. The tax-payer will no longer be available to bail out the ex semi-state and its pampered employees. Its a win-win situation for the Irish people as tax-payers and consumers.

Of course, if FR so pisses you off you can opt spend that bit extra and fly with the ex 'national 'carrier'. Flying with FR isn't compulsory. However if you do decide to go with Aerfungus you should still be careful not to botch your documentation. From what I hear, the unionized jobsworths in the ex national carrier are just as unreasonable when it comes to passports etc.

by Wordsmith Wed Jan 16, 2008 02:27

Those are two heartfelt and interesting posts about Ryanair by Lipjohn and aristotle. "Dregulation would have happened anyway" you say. Yes, our membership of the EU (an organisation dedicated to unfettered capitalist competition among its member states, while imposing punitive tariffs on third world producers) was going to shoe in air transport reforms; but the EU didn't invent the concept of no-frills air tickets - that came from entrepreneurs.

We are voluntary air passengers. Sometimes, as in the case of grandmother's funeral, we just have to fly at a moment's notice so we look around for the cheapest of dear seat tickets.

If we plan leisure trips in advance then we can choose alternatives to air. Like aristotle when I was a student (too long ago) I always took the boat and train to London in search of summer jobs. Does USI ever negotiate cheap deals for students who might consider this travel route nowadays? I availed of cheap trips across Belgium to Germany for holidays after saving up money from my summer jobs.

How many offended customers of Ryanair ever write complaints directly to Michael O'Leary? To the newspapers? I've seen some printed over the years. Regular Ryanair travellers could consider establishing a national organisation of consumers to lobby effectively for better treatment and staff manners.

by gmartin888 - Earth Sun May 31, 2009 19:15 jeronimo169 at hotmail dot com

I just wanted to mention here, that recently I was due to fly with Ryanair to Malaga from Bournemouth airport, and my surprise when I arrived to the airport was that the check in desk had closed 5 minutes earlier that they should have (45 minutes before departure instead of 40), when I explained that all I had was the hand luggage and all I needed was the boarding card, they simply said that check in was closed, I then asked to speak to the supervisor who simply said that they had closed check in and therefore I was not allowed to fly, when I mentioned the terms and conditions stated in their website and on my itinerary, she just simply called security, security came, saw that I wasn't a threat and was just making my point accross and decided to leave. I then asked for a complete re-fund, to what they replied producing two scruffy pieces of paper with no telephone number, just an address and a fax number, one for complaints and the other for refunds. ONLY THEN I REALISED WHAT A SCAM ARTIST OF A CORPORATION RYANAIR REALLY IS!!!!

Apparently, it happens to quite a few people everyday, and the practice is called overbooking!!, they overbook their flights and once the plane is full, they simply close check in earlier making lots of money on ghost passangers...hehe, passangers like myself who pay good money for their flight but never get to see their seats!, let alone their destinations!!

By the way, I never got a penny back from the flight that never happened, but I hope that this company loses its license to fly!, at least from Bournemouth!