State in pre-May Day crack-down

by Sean - none Sun May 02, 2004 02:26 seaneen at esatclear dot ie

I am just back from a tremendous day in Dublin City-Centre. The weather was excellent, the free food was good, the free booze was nicer, and most of the strange music made me want to dance (what was with the thigh-slapping though!? )

I felt that it was a pity that quite a sizeable number of people didn't seem to enjoy themselves, but were instead more intent on finding stuff wrong. Yes, the EU is pretty screwey right now, yes, the Garda presence was a bit overwhelming (but then, 9 times out of 10, people are complaing about the *lack* of Gardai, so I don't know...)

But this is a great day, 10 new nations joining the EU makes 10 more reasons why WWIII won't be started in Europe, and 10 more places for me to go and maybe find work, maybe find love, definately find new and interesting friends. And it is a great pity that more of *you* people did not come to Dublin with that in mind.

I dont' know about anyone else, but the sight of a gang of masked men walking the streets of Dublin sent a shiver down my spine. For those of you who don't know, it is illegal in this country to go about wearing balaclavas or masks without reasonable cause (under anti-terrorism legislation that is about 20 years old if you must know) so I thought it was very restrained of the Gardai that they didn't start arresting people right off the bat. I would have. We, as a nation, do not like people in masks, as generally they carry AK47s and want to shoot us or plant bombs. We had a bit of a problem with that you see. There's not much that al Qaida can teach the PIRA or UDA, is there??

The sight of men ganging up on a female reporter was unpleasant also - what happened to human rights, freedom of the press, respect for each other? (And yes, I was there the other night, but not for long after that ugly little scene). I understand that the journo published her story today, well done lads, another good headline for the cause (this is me being sarcastic, in case you don't get it).

And then I wandered along to the park to see if the Gardai go nuts like May Day 2 years ago of which I had personal experience (I wasn't lucky enough to get whacked unfortunately, I could really do with the cash right now!!! BTW, did anyone else notice that every copper had his/her numbers on? No fucking up this time! )

And what did we see? A line of coppers, arms linked, not a baton in sight, and I thought, "Oh, that's a good one! The cops are gonna show the TV that THEY aren't going to start any trouble, but as soon as some dumb fucker throws something, the Riot Squad will be up with the PSNI trucks "

And that's exactly what happened - oh what dissapointment - almost as much as noting how many "protesters" were wearing Nikes & Doc Martens, McKenzie sweaters (but get this, the guy had written some guff about anarchy on the back, so that makes it OK to buy 'Made (by 16-year old workers in a sweatshop' in Indonesia' clothes, right??) & FCUK t-shirts. Not a good day. Once the riot squad was out I went to the Tide and sat wondering how to fix a broken movement. It'll take a better mind than my slightly sozzled, second rate copy to come up with the solution to that one. So I'm not going to worry about it, I'm just gonna keep doing my small bit by using what little power I have to influence my friends, my family, the TDs from my area, against racism, totalitarianism, capitalism, and doing bad shit to my fellow human beings. To paraphrase a great author and humanist, the rights of one person ends where the rights of another begins. More protesters should try to remember that.
slainte all, good night from Dublin, peace be with you
sean.

by Dublin 8 Fri Apr 30, 2004 10:46

I can't wait until the WOMBLES meet the indigenous population of Dublin 1. You're gonna need more padding than that my friend.

Oh, and all the traffic deaths this weekend as a result of all the gardai, who would have been on our roads being drafted in to deal with this threat. All those dead people... who are living now but will be dead by Monday.

They're lives are on YOUR heads!

by P O'Neil - People Fri Apr 30, 2004 00:42 people4people at eircom dot net Leeson St 01 6606896

To the bright sparks who are intent on on provocation of violence as a recourse for their own obvious limitations.

Ireland is not a police state dickwits. In fact its under policed. I know.

Last time we had a herd of animals coming in mass from over the pond they tore up lansdowne stadium at a family sporting event and threatened the innocent. The garda "protected and served" their employer. Us the people.

So its no wonder there may be an over reaction for the intellectually challenged onion mules.

They have my permission to addess the threat of danger to the innocents.

Funny. A lot of what what I'm saying is somewhat aligned to your beliefs. But you're anger will see you attempt to destroy dublin.

You don't believe. You destroy. You disrupt. Without purpose or alternative. You are a mindless minority without reason. You are pathetic racists wishing to show Ireland a taste of hooliganism. Clever. Real clever little boyz. Stay away Ingerland.

by Steve Thu Apr 29, 2004 19:20

Cut an onion open and THEN use it as a missile, only 10,000 times weaker than tear gas!

I'd better hide the carrots, they could give someone a very annoying prod!

by Zombie Thu Apr 29, 2004 05:42

Snore

The Derelict Sites Act 1990 would fall under Irish Civil Law, and not Irish Criminal Law.

Pick up your wee manuscript and reread it. You may learn something.

i.e. same act

8.—(1) Every local authority shall, within one year after the commencement of this Act, establish and thereafter maintain a register to be known as "the derelict sites register" and which is referred to in this Act as "the register" and shall enter on to the register—

( a ) particulars of any land in their functional area which, in their opinion, is a derelict site,
( b ) the name and address of each owner and occupier, where these can be ascertained by reasonable enquiry,
( c ) particulars of any action taken by the local authority under this Act or under any other enactment in relation to the site,
( d ) in the case of land owned or occupied by a local authority, particulars of the use, if any, which is being made of the land and particulars of any purpose for which the land is intended to be used,
( e ) particulars of the market value of urban land as determined by the local authority, or by the Tribunal on appeal, in accordance with the provisions of section 22, and such other particulars as may be prescribed.
(2) Before making any entry on the register in relation to any land, the local authority shall give to any owner and occupier, where they can be ascertained by reasonable enquiry, notice of their intention to make such entry and shall consider any representations any owner or occupier may make in writing within such period as may be specified in the notice and may either make the entry or not as they think proper having regard to such representations.

(3) A local authority may remove an entry from the register where they consider that the entry is no longer appropriate.

(4) A local authority shall remove an entry from the register (and record in the register the date on which this is done) in relation to a derelict site where

( a ) a notice under section 11 has been complied with, or
( b ) steps have been taken under section 11 (5) to give effect to the terms of a notice under section 11, or
( c ) the land has otherwise ceased to be a derelict site.
(5) The register shall be kept at the offices of the local authority and shall be available for inspection at the offices of the local authority during office hours.

(6) A copy of the register or an entry in the register shall be sent to the Minister on request.

(7) Notice of an entry in the register shall be served by the local authority on the owner and occupier of a site in respect of which an entry has been made in the register where such persons can be ascertained by reasonable enquiry.

(8) Every document purporting to be a copy of an entry in the register and purporting to be certified by an officer of a local authority to be a true copy of the entry shall, without proof of the signature of the person purporting so to certify or that he was such officer, be received in evidence in any legal proceedings and shall, until the contrary is proved, be deemed to be a true copy of the entry and be evidence of the terms of the entry.

(9) Evidence of an entry in the register may be given by production of a copy thereof certified pursuant to this section and it shall not be necessary to produce the register itself.

and most importantly......

27.—An offence under this Act may be prosecuted by the local authority in whose functional area the offence is committed.

"the owners of derelict buildings are
the real criminals that the gardai should be
attending." Looks to me like they can't.

Yet they obviously can arrest 3 good for nothings who have no interest in contribution and decide they will break into and trespass on another persons private property.

case rested

by Phuq Hedd Wed Apr 28, 2004 22:49

I'm sure that you know as well as I do that if, and I say if, that were to happen then there'd be an enquiry held at Dublin Castle and we'd get to the bottom of it all.

I think it's obvious even to the voter at the ballot-box that this is an open, democratic society and that the rich are not treated differently to anyone else.

To suggest otherwise is communist and anti-european and could only be done by a foreign anarchist.

by judge dredd Wed Apr 28, 2004 22:40

Well it's not so bad if you're a judge 'cos the Gardai will screw up with the search warrant, the DPP won't notice and you'll get off the hook ........ even if you do end up loosing th'ould job you're still likely to get a juicy compensation package ........

by pc Wed Apr 28, 2004 21:14

from derelcit sites act 1990

9.—lt shall be the duty of every owner and occupier of land, including a statutory body and a State authority, to take all reasonable steps to ensure that the land does not become or does not continue to be a derelict site.

10.—It shall be the duty of a local authority to take all reasonable steps (including the exercise of any appropriate statutory powers) to ensure that any land situate in their functional area does not become or continue to be a derelict site.

(land means buildings too)

theres also laws under local authorty and dangerous structures to say owners should keep buildings in good condition

aslo in my other posting i mentioned the occupations in 70s of georgian buildings for conservation reasons which was then lauded as a service to nation by many a person

when last did you break the law?

by Zombie Wed Apr 28, 2004 20:57

Joe you quote Liz Curry as follows....

"With rising homelessness and lengthening
housing lists, the owners of derelict buildings are
the real criminals that the gardai should be
attending. Perfectly good buildings are allowed to
fall into disrepair so that they can be demolished,
and a small minority of big owners engage in property
speculation while people are forced into paying
extortionate amounts for housing."

....in such a way that it is implied you are a devouted believer. Hmmmm my problem seems to be that the word criminal means a person guilty of a crime. Now please enlighten me with your knowledge of Irish Criminal Legislation and tell me what offence a private owner of a private property commits by allowing his/her private property to become derelict.

And dont come back with your ethical spiritual treehugger nonsense about how it should be a crime or needs to be a crime. The simple fact is, it is not a crime!! This would further suggest that these people are NOT the real criminals that the Gardai should be attending.

On the point of "extortionate amounts for housing" you have your choices. Do or do not, or you can always feck off to Peru and go unshaven in sandles all day and hug your trees.

Nope I won't be protesting this weekend, but that is not to say I will not be there.....wink wink......nudge nudge.....

:)

by Dub Wed Apr 28, 2004 18:41

Bomb scare blocks off Dorset Street.
Build up the tension.

by Angry Loaner with an irrational grudge against crash helmets - Working Worker Worker's Party. Wed Apr 28, 2004 18:16

I have lost family members to lethal 'poster making equipment', crash helmets and assorted veg.

by Joe Wed Apr 28, 2004 17:57

So these are all the items that the Gardai have harrassed or even arrested people over so far

1. Leaflets advertising protests
2. Posters advertising protests
3. Stickers advertising protests
4, Onions (in case they are used as missiles)
5. Spray paint
6. Bits of card/paper with holes cut in them
7. Helmets

Who was it suggested that 'close to a police state' was a bit much?

In case its not clear the stencil and spray paint formed the 'objects that could cause damage' mentioned all over the media. A phrase intended I'm sure to suggest hammers, axes and baseball bats. I suspect every home in Ireland must have some paper and paint so who knows whose next!

by chaman Wed Apr 28, 2004 17:50

itis reported that three charged. one guy had spraycans and stencils=intent to cause damage

"They have been give consent to bail which they must take up in the next 24 hours under the following conditions:


that they reside at address satisfactory to the Garda


that they sign on Monday, Wednesday and Friday at Bridewell Garda Station


that they surrender their passports


that they each give a personal surety of €450, one third of which must be lodged with the court


that they each give an independent surety of €1,500, one third of which must be lodged with the court."

maybe they'll still make it out so?

by fat people are hard to kidnap Wed Apr 28, 2004 16:42

If you're handing out points for areresting people for pocession of phones, vegetables and posters its hardly much of a contest.

We're not even at the kick off yet so don't be so quick with your scoring !

by Joe Wed Apr 28, 2004 16:06

"The building in question has been derelict for years
and is listed as such in Thom's Directory. Curry
commented: "With rising homelessness and lengthening
housing lists, the owners of derelict buildings are
the real criminals that the gardai should be
attending. Perfectly good buildings are allowed to
fall into disrepair so that they can be demolished,
and a small minority of big owners engage in property
speculation while people are forced into paying
extortionate amounts for housing."

So we disagree, you reckon property rights come before people we don't. I won't expect to see you on the protests then!

by Zombie Wed Apr 28, 2004 16:06

Gardai 1

Treehuggers 0



Mmmm this is getting exciting!!!

by Zombie Wed Apr 28, 2004 15:58

I think its all mad. These people come over here and break into buildings and think they are not going to be arrested??? And they now have to sleep on the streets coz the Gardai have prevented them from breaking the law??

My solution is

1. They get a bloody job and then they can come over here when they feel like it and stay in the penhouse in the 4 seasons for the 5 days, gorging themselves on room service and the likes

2. If Liz Curry (or anyone in Dublin Grassroots) thinks this sort of behaviour is acceptable why doesnt she post me her address and then she can expect me to be sitting on her couch, drinking her herbal tea and smoking her disco biscuits (or whatever she is on), and watching 'Save the trees' on her TV, when she gets home from all the hard protesting over the weekend. Hmmmm will she find the fact that I have kicked in her front door, or the fact that I am trespassing on her property acceptable?? Doubt it

My Point
Property always belongs to someone. If you do not like what someone is doing with their private property then get a job and save your money and buy that property and do with it what you initially wished.

by Frankly Wed Apr 28, 2004 14:26

On two occasions when my home was broken into the guards did not display the same amount of enthusiasm in trying to investigate it as they are displaying in preventing these protests

by pc Wed Apr 28, 2004 14:19

as dangerous weapons???

how about food

hahahaha

by pc Wed Apr 28, 2004 14:18

...very informative

by Dublin Grassroots Network Wed Apr 28, 2004 14:08

The arrests of three protestors in Dublin last night
(Tuesday night) have been branded by protest
organisers as simply the latest in a campaign of garda
harassment in the run-up to next weekend’s protests.
Dublin Grassroots Network spokesperson Laurence Cox
said on Wednesday: "The police have already made major
mistakes with their intimidatory approach to policing
the Mayday weekend of events for an alternative
Europe, and have been widely criticised for doing so
[1]. Last night's arrests were unnecessary and will
only serve to heighten tensions."

Spokesperson Liz Curry added: "Instead of allowing
people to quietly occupy a criminally derelict
building for use as an accommodation centre, the
gardai have now created a situation where over a
hundred protestors will be arriving in Dublin from
abroad with nowhere to go [2]. These people have been
forced out onto the streets of Dublin at night for a
period of five days." [3]

The building in question has been derelict for years
and is listed as such in Thom's Directory. Curry
commented: "With rising homelessness and lengthening
housing lists, the owners of derelict buildings are
the real criminals that the gardai should be
attending. Perfectly good buildings are allowed to
fall into disrepair so that they can be demolished,
and a small minority of big owners engage in property
speculation while people are forced into paying
extortionate amounts for housing."

The gardai also confiscated protective clothing from
the accommodation centre. Spokesperson Aileen
O'Carroll noted, "In the face of police and media
hysteria, people have the right to protect their
bodies in whatever way they feel necessary, in a
context where live rounds, rubber bullets, water
cannons and tear gas are being deployed to suppress
dissent. After the televised attacks on protestors at
May Day two years ago, is it any wonder that
protestors feel the need for protective clothing?"

Dublin Grassroots Network called on the state and
Gardai to cease the harassment of visiting activists
[4]. O'Carroll said, "They have every right to come to
Dublin and engage in meaningful protest against the
policies of Fortress Europe. They require a space to
sleep. Any future space provided for protesters must
be left alone, for practical reasons. Nobody wants to
see visitors wandering the streets at night. The
gardai must not repeat a similar mistake."

The spokespeople noted that the gardai have a
constitutional obligation to facilitate peaceful
protest. "Unfortunately the indications are that those
responsible for the gardai have instructed them to do
everything possible to prevent people exercising their
right to protest", said Cox. "Once again we are
calling for a low-key policing strategy and a lowering
of tensions."

-- FOOTNOTES --

[1] This has been tacitly recognised in the way that
various official spokespersons have sought in recent
days to downplay numbers of police and protestors,
talk of the need for calm etc., after weeks of
hysteria in which many of the same individuals played
a leading part.

[2] Routinely at anti-globalisation in Europe and
elsewhere, municipal governments have provided
accommodation for visiting protestors for practical
reasons. This was the case for example in Florence for
the European Social Forum, in Porto Alegre for the
World Social Forum and even in Genoa for the G8
summit.

[3] Irish law on squatting of derelict buildings is a
draconian relic of the 1970s which is out of step with
most, if not all, other European jurisdictions, where
public squats are an acknowledged part of the city
landscape and often act as socio-cultural centres
hosting films, gigs and other activities. Uniquely in
Ireland, squatting is a felony.

[4] This kind of dirty tricks has been a recurrent
feature of police preparations for this protest. Over
the past two weeks, DGN leafletters were persistently
harassed by gardai in breach of their constitutional
rights. Over the past week, gardai have been visiting
city-centre businesses and encouraging them to close
for the weekend. Stories have subsequently appeared
about the fears of business-owners with no mention of
how those fears had been fueled.


For more information, including Mayday event plans,
see:
www.struggle.ws/eufortress

by T Wed Apr 28, 2004 13:50

Holding these people for the minor charge of treespass for 9 days and on very hefty bail for which I doubt they have the money to raise is a disgrace.

This is a prime example of how this country and the EU at large is turning into a Police State.

The State is clearly using this to prevent these people from making their voice heard in the next few days and preventing their right to protest.

I can't think of anyone in recent times who charged with tresspass has received such a harsh sentence..

by Illegal Eagle Wed Apr 28, 2004 13:41

Of course the judiciary will say 'how high?'.
Won't it help when they get caught for more serious things. For example, they might be able to dodge out of being done for, perhaps, kiddyfiddling or things like that.

by Curious Wed Apr 28, 2004 13:41

That this is all stage managed. To show what a wonderful job the guards are doing?

by Wed Apr 28, 2004 13:36

'A number of items, including crash helmets, assorted tools and poster-making equipment were seized.'

I doubt they'll be getting these back, even though none of them are in any way illegal.

by Chekov Wed Apr 28, 2004 13:31

Our 'independent' judiciary saying 'how high?' to the government as usual.

by tobermory - n/a Wed Apr 28, 2004 13:31

As far as I know the wombles don't have a membership structure, no ID cards to flash. I guess any brit arrested in Ireland over the mayday period is gonna be called a "womble" whether they've ever had anything to do with them or not. c'est la vie....

by Joe Wed Apr 28, 2004 13:30

"In Dublin District Court today the 3 people were remanded in custody until May 6th by judge Patrick Brady"

In other words a very minor charge (Tresspass) which hundreds of hill walkers and holiday makers will be 'guilty' of over this weekend has been used to prevent Europeans protesting against the policies of the EU. Will the liberals and left respond or will the defening silence continue?

All out over the mayday weekend!

by Wed Apr 28, 2004 13:24

Is that €450 each or for all 3? Obvious reasons why they are being held til the 6th.

by questions Wed Apr 28, 2004 13:21

Questions:

1) NewsTalk 106 has been claiming all morning that these 3 were 'members of the wombles' - I'm very curious how one is determined to be a 'womble'

Did they admit this card carrying membership in court? or to the Garda?

also

2) is 41 Leeson St the same place as the FORMER magpie squat, or somewhere else? certainly the media are sloppy enough to associate the Magpies with the Wombbles if only because they were on the same street.

by Joe Wed Apr 28, 2004 13:09

With Bertie calling us all hooligans yesterday it looks like the government is trying to incite a riot. Yesterday they also stopped two people coming from Moore st with a load of vegtables on the 'grounds' that onions could be used as missiles.

All out on Mayday!

by IMC insecurity correspondent Wed Apr 28, 2004 13:00

Details on the court appearance of 3 people arrested for trespass - which was big news apparently
Rang the Garda Press office. They did not issue a statement last night, but were willing to confirm that 3 UK nationals were arrested for trespass under the 1994 Public Order Act.

In Dublin District Court today the 3 people were remanded in custody until May 6th by judge Patrick Brady on a bail bond of €450 and Independent Surety of €1500 each. The charges were trespass although gardai stated more serious charges may be brought later.

The 3 people were arrested after a raid on a premises at 41 Leeson St., ‘going on information received’. There could be more serious charges brought later. One of those charged was found in possession of ‘implements of damage’. If they make bail they will have to sign on every 3 days. There was also an issue regarding confirmed addresses in the UK which could affect the granting of bail.

The names of each person were given – read your local tabloid for details.

by pc Wed Apr 28, 2004 12:46

well im not emphasing the famousness of then ( and i know thats not what dunk was suggesting) but its seems all those people are very quiet now on the issue of people getting arrested for just actions

by dunk Wed Apr 28, 2004 12:40

duncan stewert, the white haired guy who presented our house, and long time eco activst was definately one, ruari quinn was another i think

they were protecting the destruction of georgian dublin

by pc Wed Apr 28, 2004 12:32

i spent the other day reading about hume street, pemborke street fitzwilliam street merrion street occupations during the 70's

which you can find in the newspapers clippings by street in the ilac library

although the occupations were on the issue of conservation there is endless articles detailing individuals tds senators ngo and arts groups and those who turned up to on the street supportting the idea of breaking the law for justifible ethical reasons....

i think people understand that

the ppl who did those "illegal occupations"
did us all a huge favour, long may it continue

everyone breaks the law everyday

by Very Pissed OFF Wed Apr 28, 2004 12:11

Its officially illegal to engage in peaceful protest.
the "free speech zones" now extend no further than the inside of your own head.

Cops can do whatever they feel like, they could arrest these people on suspicion of cattle rustling if they want and they will face no consequences for abuse of power.

Public order offences now amount to a 'right' to intern anybody at any time for any reason.

by jh Wed Apr 28, 2004 12:11

must be troublemakers then

by Updater Wed Apr 28, 2004 12:06

Three arrested at Dublin squat due in court
By Patrick Logue Last updated: 28-04-04, 09:48

Three men and a woman, believed to be May Day protesters, are due in court in Dublin this morning after they were arrested at derelict house last night.

A man aged 38, another aged 18 and a 20-year-old woman, all thought to be English, were arrested in a squat on Leeson Street in the city centre at 10 p.m. last night. They were held in the Bridewell Garda Station overnight.

They are due to in Dublin District Court this morning charged under the Public Order Act. A Garda spokeswoman said items including crash helmets, balaclavas and mobile phones were seized in the raid on the house.

A major security operation is being mounted in Dublin for the upcoming May Day celebrations at the weekend. The Phoenix Park is being sealed off and 5,000 gardaí are expected in the capital to police the events marking the accession of ten states to the European Union. Thousands of anti-globalisation protesters are also expected to congregate in Dublin, some from overseas.