Will Ingrid Betancourt be next ?

by a little balance to above Tue May 06, 2003 16:31 http://www.narconews.com/Issue29/article747.html

http://www.narconews.com/Issue29/article747.html

by pat c Tue May 06, 2003 16:39

thousands have been killed by state death squads. this doesnt bother joe. he is happy to support the colombian government.

by joe ranii Tue May 06, 2003 18:35

Pat: That just isn't true. I suspect you know nothing whatever about Colombia. But if you think that murdering people after holding them hostage for years is a good idea, then you are either mad or bad, and are beyond any logical discourse I can offer.

by Yossarian Tue May 06, 2003 19:12

Joe: "But if you think that murdering people after holding them hostage for years is a good idea.."

Me: I don't. Then neither is death row. I also would not believe for a second that the Colombian Army would resist executing some rebels that they capture.

by damnbutter Tue May 06, 2003 22:34

Joe your one-sided slant on the Colombian civil war needs to be honed a bit better if you want your selectively anti-FARC and ELN reports to be taken anyway credibly.

Colombian society is not united in horror at these deaths, huge numbers of people in communities all over Colombia are united in horror at the death visited upon them daily by Colombian army soldiers, plantation owners, police, paramilitaries, mercenaries who all enjoy the support of the Colombian government, such as it is. People who dehumanise the enemy to gain licence for atrocities carried out in this disgusting "war on terror". (FARC murder "machine" eh?)

by Jason K Wed May 07, 2003 09:31

The guy condemned the murder of those hostages. Is it "one-sided" to be against that kind of thing ? It just sounds like normal human decency to me.

by pat c Wed May 07, 2003 09:49

i never sdaid i supported what the farc did. i was highlighting your double standards.

you have on many occasions described the colombian government as democratic.

i think the farc should not have killed those soldiers. the former defense minister is a different case. he would have sent out the army to murder and loot. the same is likely true of the governor.

by joe ranii Wed May 07, 2003 17:46

"you have on many occasions described the colombian government as democratic".

It is. This is not a question of my opinion; it's a fact. The Colombian government is chosen in parliamentary and presidential elections which are observed by foreign experts and have never been challenged as to democratic validity.
One of the reasons I write postings here is that I know something about Colombia, and I am convinced that a lot of the Irish people who shout loudest about that country know little or nothing. One person criticized me for only posting from news agencies, but it's precisely my aim to give the truth--as far as it can be established--about Colombia, not my own opinions.
That's why I paste from reputable news reports--I am giving facts, which not surprisingly have not been challenged by the posters here who still harbour illusions about the FARC.

In my case, I don't like the Colombian government policies of increasing taxes and weakening the meagre protections the poor have in that country. The Ahern/PD government in Ireland is not to my liking either. But in neither case do I think that social injustice and corruption justifies people kidnapping others, keeping them captive for years, and then ending their lives with a bullet in the head. That's the modus operandi of FARC and its kindred, and it needs to be exposed to those who are naive enough to have illusions that the FARC are a blend of Robin Hood and Che Guevara.

by damnbutter Thu May 08, 2003 13:23

Joe you are either a complete moron or an unashamed serial apologist for indefensible corrupt bandit regimes like the Colombian one. This government would be a massive improvement if it only increased taxes and weakened the meagre (i.e non-existent)protections for the poor which you seem to believe is all the blame that can be laid at it's door. It would first have to dismantle the institutionalised patronage and influence systems which control virtually all aspects of Colombian legislation, military and political direction.

For you of course the only problem is the operations of leftist rebels in a vicious civil war which is rooted in peoples desperation with this filthy regime. It is not peoples perception of the entrenched injustice and corruption of the state that fuels conflict, resistance is fuelled by the visible evidence of the oppression unleashed to sustain it, assasination, arrest, torture, collective punishment.

As for your outrage over keeping people locked up for years and ending their lives with a bullet in the head, have a glance at the activities of the state there once in a while.

by pat c Thu May 08, 2003 13:32

are you aware that farc at one stage formed an open political party? 3,000 members of that party were murdered by state death squads.

there are no open and free elections in colombia.

by Maubere Fri May 09, 2003 23:17

The reation of an ordinary decent person would be to condemn ALL murders in Colombia. Of course Joe consistently refuses to condemn the Colombian government and it terrorist army and death squads,

As George W said "if you help a terrorist then you are a terrorist"
well seeing as the main terrorist force in Colombia is the right wing drug dealing AUC, and the AUC is known in Colombia as the "Sixth Division" (there are 5 regular divisions in the Colombian army) becsuse of its links to the government and the US gives millions to the Colombian army each year, I think that would make George W a bona fide terrorist!!
and Joe is silent on this campaign of terrorism that has killed over 250,000 in the past 40 years,

PS the political party referred to above is the Patriotic Union, it was formed in the late 80s by members of the M19 guerrilla group who had declared a ceasfire. Since then over 3000 of their members have been murdered by the "democratic" government.