Secret Irish Data Repository Uncovered

by Hebe Wed Feb 26, 2003 13:57

-Indymedia has no respect for privacy of citizens.
by Tony Mc Manus Tue, Feb 25 2003, 5:51pm

If you are Geraldine Wilson and you work for the Department of Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht, then you are one of the individuals Indymedia has named as logging onto this website. (refer to http://ireland.indymedia.org/cgi-bin/newswire.cgi?id=28800) -

The above named is likely to be the SysAdmin of AGH. By publishing the fact that their proxy server is being used by staff members to access indymedia then the net result will likely be that indy ends up as a barred site.

Why is there a need to make these IP addresses of those who access indy availible?

by Phuq Hedd Tue Feb 25, 2003 20:32

I think that stripping out the visiting IP-addresses might be a good move.

W.r.t. the actual parent/topic post about the Secret Data Repository, it throws the whole Gardai request Howlin/Higgins phone records in Galway-Garda corruption case into a new light doesn't it?

QUOTE:
Senator Higgins said: "It is an extremely serious issue. I would be prepared to go to the courts to defend the right of an Oireachtas member to receive information without having to account for its source. I would regard any decision to allow access to the telephone records of members of Dail Eireann as a major intrusion into the affairs of elected representatives.

But if telecommunications records are kept then the feckers may have had access to them already. Senators Higgins and Howlin can't avoid having the affairs of elected representatives interfered with if the State is trawling for every telecomm interaction. Even if there were specific exemptions made for elected-representatives there'd still be a record if Joe Public calls _to_ his elected-"representative".

by Daithi Tue Feb 25, 2003 19:34

I think so ;-)

but regarding the statistics - I think the idea is that instead of providing a sanitised and filtered report (i.e. the elite with access controls what the users are told), users can draw their own conclusions from the numbers and form their own impressions rather than being told what to think. I say "I think" because I didn't release them, but I broadly think it's a good idea - the data is fairly useless as it's just things like 123.1.123.1 4598 views of the site, or a list of stories and the views per page. There's no individualised data (i.e. certain address for certain page on certain date). But maybe it would be better to be cautious and screen out the IP section and just look at page views, geographical distribution of IP addresses, date by date hits etc?

all ideas are welcome, except from those who are just going to make stuff up.

by Phuq Hedd Tue Feb 25, 2003 19:27

I think Tony is just looking for an excuse to get on your/indymedia.ie 's case ......

but .....

there is no reason for indymedia.ie to be publishing site access statistics which include IP addresses is there?

So, why do that?

Probably this discussion should be held on tech-list instead of in the newswire, but seeing as it's here..

by Daithi Tue Feb 25, 2003 19:16

Tony, like I said before, that information was taken by a user (not by an editor or anyone with special access) from a list of IP addresses that had accessed the site - the data pertains to a publicly listed register of domain name owners/administrators, and, once again, does not mean that the person in particular can even spell Indymedia. This information is publicly available - if you think this is a bad idea, then contact ICANN or someone with responsibility for domain name management that publish these details.

Does that clear things up? Even if we had the ability to track users we wouldn't. But we don't, and this post that you are referring to has nothing whatsoever to do with that question.

by Ray Tue Feb 25, 2003 19:07

Some posters to indymedia have posted some work addresses. I think its a pretty stupid thing to do, but that's not the point. This information is _freely available_. The use you make of it is up to you.
What's next? Are you going to sue Eircom for publishing people's phone numbers? Are you going to blame indymedia if somebody copies a phone number out of the the phone book, and posts it here?

by Tony Mc Manus Tue Feb 25, 2003 18:51

If you are Geraldine Wilson and you work for the Department of Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht, then you are one of the individuals Indymedia has named as logging onto this website. (refer to http://ireland.indymedia.org/cgi-bin/newswire.cgi?id=28800)

I could not believe it when I looked at the above news thread, Indymedia publishing names of those who logged on. This is a blatant insult to the privacy of those who would like to log onto the site from time to time. Why was it allowed to happen? I cannot believe the dopey arguments put forward by those who thinks it's O.K.

ITS NOT OK and same should be removed and an aploogy issued by the people who edit and control this web site.

by James McKenna Tue Feb 25, 2003 17:00

Never though I'd see the day when the establishment would be paranoid about being tracked.

A

by ipsiphi Tue Feb 25, 2003 16:40

twas I folks. I when bored on Feb 14 280 articles ago I listed by name government and other individuals to draw attention to the "reports" page of Ireland imc. I correctly pointed out the heavy use of the site by AerRianta.
IF you would like to trace this "rumour panic mongering back a few weeks go check out
http://ireland.indymedia.org/cgi-bin/newswire.cgi?id=28800 and comments.
The are IMC spying on us on them on everyone is a regular feature. It started in different guise last March and so far has spawned over 100 comments, five distinct "news articles" and over ten diferent "opinion threads".
just to let you know.
check out this as well for the kick of "knowing how people progress with their ideas and how they voice them".
http://www.ireland.indymedia.org/cgi-bin/newswire.cgi?id=6252

by Daithi - 1 of IMC IE Tue Feb 25, 2003 13:25

Terry, you are a liar: if you can produce details of the individuals we have named for accessing the site, please do. We do NOT have the ability to track individual IP addresses - and if you had any knowledge of the world around you you would know that even that couldn't give us names in most cases. We do get aggregated data for page requests which tells us how many users come from particular IP addresses, how many times each page was accessed, the search engines that track the site, etc. If you have a problem with this then I trust that you will take it up with every other site on the WWW, which gets similar data - the only difference is that they don't allow users to view it, like we do. Everything done here is in the open. Surely you don't have a problem with that?

Maybe you are not actually ignorant and trying to start a fight, and are just confused by a previous post where someone posted the domain name record for a particular address - this included the "named contact" on that domain but of course doesn't mean that that particular person even knows what Indymedia is. Or maybe the naming of someone who was known by other users (wow, what a high tech solution...)

I'll say it again, just in case you are getting lost: you have published a blatant and malicious lie. Now I'm waiting for your proof. And as for your assertion that because one of the IMC activists works for an ISP (last time I checked, there were other people working for ISPs too, and they're not criminals either), are you just speculating or do you really think that they are using their job to track users?

by gee whizz Tue Feb 25, 2003 13:25

ehh yeah thanks terry, but doesnt every site do the same, most do it under the guise of collecting marketing research, everything you do online is recorded, most companies dont allow any use of the internet other than work so anything not work is as potentially risky as indymedia, which is a news service and not a political hotbed of dissent unless you are blinkered , but if you want to make us paranoid about logging on at work surely you could have warned us that logging on at home is also just as risky if anyone seriously wanted to keep their beady unblinking eye on you, maybe we should only use internet caffes but be sure they have no cctv and while we are at it we should wear laytex gloves so we dont leave fingerprints on keyboards, ooooh, maybe we shouldnt use the internet, never voice an opinion, keep our heads down, and hope whatever boogeyman you believe in doesnt bother you. what we need is some sort of oligarchy to protect us from ourselves, thank god you boys at fg have our best interests in mind.

by Ray Tue Feb 25, 2003 13:18

Indymedia don't track users of the site. A civil servant was identified on indymedia, yeah, but not by examination of the server logs, and not by any of the site administrators. He was identified because if you knew the guy in real life you'd soon identify him online. He used (part of) his real name, and mentioned organisations and campaigns he'd been involved in, so it was kind of obvious. (Just as its kind of obvious who I am, and there are plenty of people who could tell you my surname without messing around with server logs or IP tracking)

(Your workplace can track internet use, BTW, so if posting to indymedia can get you fired, don't post from work)

by Terry Tue Feb 25, 2003 13:10

Beware that Indymedia.ie montior and store data on individuals who log onto this website. They have even named individual staff in Government Departments who logged onto this site. I would strongly advise persons not to log onto Indymedia.ie at the workplace (unless you have an extraordinary employer who allows company equipment to be used for non-company work). If Indymedia allowed the privacy of the individual to be disregarded in this manner, they could easily do it again, and worse. I also know an Indymedia activist who works in one of the ISPs and can track every site you visit if he wishes to. The advice is be cautious.