Pics of arrests at NYC Demo . . .

by Harold Bishop Sun Feb 16, 2003 03:26

And Bush claims to be going into Iraq to bring democracy to their country. How can we believe that he will bring democracy to Iraq when he will not allow protest in his own country?

by jack tobin - glastonbury[ct.] peace and justice organization Sun Feb 16, 2003 05:36 jacktobin at allvantage dot com 860-657-9583

Once again, proof that the police serve the ruling class, not the masses or the law.

by john Sun Feb 16, 2003 13:08 molochai_ at hotmail dot com

It's a plutocracy.

You have two right-wing inherently pro-business parties and the ability to run for public office is very much dependant on either personal wealth or backing from other wealthy organisations.

In the United States public perception seems to be that the more successful a person is, the more capital they accumulate as a measure of their success. Take New York's current mayor - a man with an estimated $1 billion in personal wealth.

Given that 10% of the *working* population of same city are below subsistance level and that the average salary is around $35,000, how can such a person be representative of the people?

It's important to remember that the US has no history of left wing politics. It is the homeland of a certain type of socio-political structure (capitalism) and as such is the most rigirous in the implementation of same. Leftist policies can be portrayed in the big-business ran media as anti-american.

The US political and media (add health, social services etc) sectors are dominated by big business. The very idea of it being otherwise is seen as practically communist (and so of no merit whatsoever). This system is operated for and by a certain economic class of people within the US. A nation that has supported dictators and warlords of the very worst order for over 50 years will, like any empire defend/perpetuate itself. This is not abnormal - it will do so through media, politics, business and military action.

"Bringing Democracy" to Iraq is not a motivator here. And if it was, there are other, better political models than the US variant. The nature of the US foreign policy is not unlike that of ancient rome (autonomous provinces with their own rulers supported by roman forces etc). They called it "bringing civilisation to the barbarians", the british called it "christainity to the heathens" and now the united states is seeking an equally questionale pretext for creating a subserviant government in Iraq.

by JoAnne Bauer Mon Feb 17, 2003 03:52

I want to express my heartfelt gratitude to the courageous citizens who, defying police rule and threats to their wellbeing, took to the streets all over the globe to speak outloud against the atrocities that our governments are perpetrating against our wills and in the name of "protecting democracy."

by Ocean Mon Feb 17, 2003 05:01

Hey John,

i don't know much about the history of the left wing in america but i do know that they have one. Obviously such a history is suppressed both by the government, media and the red scares of the 50s and 60s but it does exist. to give just a few examples...

May Day, the international workers day is celebrated to commemorate some anarchists from chicago who were matyred (during the campaign for an 8 hour working day).

The single most successful counter summit protest took place in Seatle, which highlights the existence of a sizeable left wing in america.

Now, i would speculate alongside you that the average american tends to have a more limited understanding of things like how a trade union functions and what a "communist" actually is when compared to the average irish person ...but that doesn't really say an awful lot.

writers like michael moore seem to be selling an awful lot of books which tend to highlight the problems that the leftwing has with america but without promoting revolution as a solution, which seems to be the major difference in american thinking: they think reform is possible and refuse to see the government as the problem.

by Matt in America Mon Feb 17, 2003 07:53

Howdy Ya'll
Not that I'm a flag waving patriot, or even a nationalist, but the statement that America has no history of leftist politics is quite misinformed.

Some examples? Well for starters, Quakers, Abolitionists( the "theft" of a slave was punishable by death in some states yet the underground railroad is a pilar of American History), the whiskey rebelions (tens of thousands marched on Philidaelphiia and were gunned down by soldiers to protest taxation) early trade unions such as the IWW, Emma Goldman, Alexander Berkman, Earnest Hemmingway, the Abraham Lincoln Brigade of the Spanish civil war, Paul Robeson, Henry David Thoreau, the global environmental movement since it's inception, the civil rights movement, the '60's antiwar movement, Students for a Democratic Society, the Weather Underground, the Black Panther Party for Self Defense, the American Indian Movement (AIM), the MOVE organization, Mumia Abu Jamal, more rencently, Longshoreman, treesitters, Anarchists, ELF/ALF the antiglobalization movement, the anti-war in Iraq movement (we had over 500,000 in NYC and over 2000 in my po dunk little town).

Hell, considering the Nazis who run this place and the fact that perpetrators of property crimes can end up in the joint for decades (literally, a 23 year old fellow I know is doing 22.5 years for burning 3 sport utility vehicles in protest) it seems amazing to me that America has such a history of the "Left". The truth is, folks in this country know our elections are a sham, and we have our choice of the "lessor of two evils" or "the evil of two lessors". Just do us a favor, and understand that we the people of the USA are not represented by our media or governemnt. The majority of our workers live without access to healthcare, our schools teach us to be little more than functionally literate, and the consolidation of wealth and power in this country continues...

Reform? Hell, I don't think I've ever even seen an Iraqi, but then again, I've never seen the President or any of my congress, or the people who put them in office.