Pit Stop Ploughshares Update!

by paullc Mon Jul 26, 2004 19:50

did they get a date?

by stephen Sun Jul 25, 2004 02:57

OK. Everyone stop whinging and giving out and get back on the front line

by Ms Lux - IAWM Sat Jul 24, 2004 15:56

A letter from Ms lux to the piousians

In defiant mood i loudly proclaim:
"Thou the rules of the road have been lodged its only peoples games that you have to dodge, I've got nothin'.... ma to live up to"

With exasperated sigh i gently hum;
"I can see that your head has been twisted and fed with worthless foam from the mouth"

In the cold light of day the truth I sing clearly;
"We always did feel the same we just started from a different point of view, tangled up in blue"

by Ciaron - Dublin Catholic Worker Sat Jul 24, 2004 09:56

Dilly baby.....their all religious stooooopid. "Time are a Changin'" basic rip off of The Beatitudes. (Yes "God on Our Side" tune basic rip off "The Patriot's Game"..."Plagerism is the basis of all culture!" Pete Seeger).

Man I bet you got a false dichtomy of the human and the divine, the physical and thespiritual to go with this one of Dylan's "religious" and "nonreligious" periods.

Man the Brits and the Jaansists and Manooth have screwed with your head and you don't even realise it. They've defined your perspective and your dissent for you. You confuse cynicism with wisdom, being contrary with being rebellious and trying to undermine the CW5 facing the courts as somehow different from your state's agenda!

by dilling Sat Jul 24, 2004 02:02

cos something is happening here and you don't know what it is do you mr jones

by Elaine Fri Jul 23, 2004 21:51

Wow, all you did was ask for solidarity and you end up having to defend your faith against those who don't seem to believe in anything! Thanks for non-violently opposing the war for us and thanks also for mentioning God in Temple Bar, that guy doesn't usually get a look in.
I will be there on Monday and suggest that anyone else who supports the brave act these guys are on trial for, should nail their colours to the mast now. We need more like these, let's support them while we have them.

by Ciaron - Dublin Catholic Worker & Pit Stop Ploughshares Fri Jul 23, 2004 21:22

OK...the posting was a call for solidarity for anti-war activists facing the courts and jail. The comments (& lack thereof) tell us a lot of the state of the peace movement in Ireland and the state of Irish society in general. Throwing the spiritual baby out with the religious bath water and embracing consumerism for identity.

I guess if we haven't seen or heard of you in the past 18 months. You'll be keeping your head down and ass covered as your state drags us through their courts. That's your priveleged option as the 900th. US soldier dies this past week and the U.S. Marines slay anther 25 Iraqis the following day

There is a difference....we are not statists, we do not desire the violence of state power (your prisons, armies, snoops) to realise our vision.

"Don't just do something, stand their" Fr. Dan Berigan SJ (radicals exist in every tradition! and few better than Dan and the 6 slain in San Salvador Nov 16th 1989)

But.......
"You got something better
You got a heart of stone"
Dylan "Shot of Love"
Trust the tale and not the teller..

by Ms Lux Fri Jul 23, 2004 15:22

Its amusing to see the Catholic Workers being hauled over the very same questioning coals (in terms of their hidden agenda) that the poor old trots are grilled on endlessly.

There is of course a strong and specific Jesuit agenda beneath the surface.

All a bit creepy really.

by Spotted in AIB Bank Galway City Centre Fri Jul 23, 2004 14:11

There's a photo of Damien & Ciaran in cuffs in custody flashing peace messages on their hands as part of the Media Photopgraphy awards display at the AIB Bank in the middle of Galway.

by Protest.....ant Thu Jul 22, 2004 12:49

Sorry!!.... for side-tracking the origional thread everyone (unintentional trolling!)!!!

Stephen D.,- speakers square is the place to catch Ciarán....you could hammer out your q's there and then, in person and out of the surreality of cyberspace....

Perhaps ill do the same?......

EITHERWAY-----SHOW YOUR SUPPORT FOR THE POUGHSHARES ACTIVISTS ON SAT!!!!!-----------------------------------------

In solidarity etc..

by moonwolf Thu Jul 22, 2004 00:22

Good on you Ciaran, it's just a pity that some of the left/alleged left hadn't the balls to actually do something as you lot have done.I'm sick of listening to the whinging of these swppes and their incessant attempts to devalue the work of the Shannon Ploughshares, I suppose they rather sit around sipping their glasses of guinness and planning the trotskyite world revolution!!!!!!! Just for the record i don't recognise the authority of the Pope, but thats really neither here nor there since he isint sending 10,000 troops through Shannon each month.

by Ciaron - Dublin Catholic Worker & Pitstop Ploughshares Wed Jul 21, 2004 22:44 087 918 4552 or 01- 492 6100

For further clarification on the roots and pluralism of the plowshares movement go to web www.plowsharesactions.org

For further clarifiaction on the radical christian/anarchist/pacifist Catholic Worker movement go to
www.catholicworker.org

or rent "Entertaining Angels" staring Martin Sheen and Irish actress Moira Kelly from your local video store.

or listen to the Ani DeFranco/Utah Phillips track "Anarchy" on the album "The Past Didn't Go Anywhere"

or read "Demanding the Impossible: A History of Anarchism"

or come to the 4 pm meeting at 83 Corrib Rd. on Saturday

or catch me most Sundays in Speakers Corner.

The context of this intial posting is that 5 of us are facing maximum sentences of ten years imprisonment for nonviolently resisting the war on Iraq. Our public activism over the last two years in Ireland is renowned for it's pluralism and making space for people to express themselves from whatever faith/nonfaith tradition they spring.

We ARE NOT into recruitment, ask the many non-christian crew that has made up the bulk of our support since our arrests 18 month ago.

We ARE into mutuality & solidarity with anyone from any tradition anywhere nonviolently resisting this war. We would like to think the support and solidarity we are calling for over the next 3 months has been-and will continue to be offered by CW- to anyone else before the courts for nonviolent resistance.

The 20 question trolling is either state inspired or a cynics picnic.

Cynicism remains the 5th. column of the establishment! See you in court!

by Annoyed Wed Jul 21, 2004 18:53

Editors please delete the shitstirring post by Stephen D. He is totally disruptive. This attempt to disrupt the Pit Stop thread makes me wonder if Stephen is a State Agent. Who else would gain from his divisive nactions?

by merrovinginvanjan Wed Jul 21, 2004 18:48

throwing stones than growing a spine?
I agree with you on the CW thing btw.
But on the stone throwing.
You don't really get anywhere if you've no spine. Invertebrates tend to be small, though thinking again, some of the largest sea creatures of both myth and legend, the giant squid who live in the darkest and murkiest depths, unknown fathoms down, are invertebrates and mightily strong too.

But do they throw stones? OR can we ascribe to them a facility for throwing stones?

Now this sort of comment is a wee bit troll-like. It's not sticking to the point, (expressing solidarity with the 11o'clock folk mass, or elucidation information on there many actions, or offering direct criticism of their techniques) but it's not a nasty troll type of comment, because it is not directly insulting to their very sincere beliefs or divisive.

Which is why if you *feel the urge* just to type something in the comment box, and by that re-affirm your literary or typewriting skills, or somehow justify your internet connection costs, or remind everyone that you _do_ take an active and meaningful part in protest or political activity, but you *do not* have anything useful to write, then you *too* might avoid the editors delete function, by similarly musing and reflecting on some little spark in someone else's comment-.

:-)

by Yaaaawwwn.... Wed Jul 21, 2004 18:33

ain't it clear enough from doing a search, or checking their website?

Or are you just trolling?

I'm not a Catholic Worker, but I find it funny that when the Catholic Workers ask for support in relation to an anti-war action, there's always a few people who start asking questions about the pope and abortion etc.

Besides people in political parties, do you ask other activists what their positions are on abortion or bin tax before you decide if you will support them in campaigning against unrelated issues like nuclear power or the arms trade?

Isn't it hypocritcal for anonymous posters to be asking all these questions on topics not related to the action at Shannon...

easier to throw stones than to grow a spine...

by Stephen Daedalus Wed Jul 21, 2004 17:30

I asked a question about the position of religion with the CWers and it was removed by Indymedia Editors. I'll ask it again. I would like to know what role they see for the position of the Pope. As Catholics do you support the position of the Pope as the source of authority in the Catholic Church. If so, do you then accept his views (which are the views of the Catholic Church) on divorce, homosexuality, sex before marraige, women priests, and abortion. I have seen these questions asked a number of times on Indymedia but never clearly answered. I also asked about CWers attitude to a visit by the Pope to Ireland next year.

So in short:
1. Do you agree with the position and authority of the Pope?
2. Are your views on the following different to the Catholic teaching:
a. Divorce
b. homosexuality
c. sex before marraige
d. women priests
e. abortion
3. Would you welcome the Pope to Ireland?

If the Catholic Worker organisation doesn't have positions, then what is your personal opinion?

by protest......ant - ..........DW Wed Jul 21, 2004 16:06

I dont doubt that DCW do excellent work , I know its off the point and but it puzzles me as to why intelligent , hard working activists like Ciarán etc. need to be subserviant to the Dope in Rome and carry religious banners in activism?( im sure its a frequent Q put to yee)

I would think that it has somewhat of an alienating effect to many people who may like get involved in such actions...

Of course thats only my opinion, and i dont mean to seem offensive, but i would have thought that anarchists and radicals suchlike would be opposed to religous hiearchy, typecasting and suchlike, am i wrong??

I feel orgs. like DWC, C youth service carring religoius faith and symbolism demeans the good work yee/ they do and exposes Catholic church rcruitment on the hush (paranoia maybe??)...

While religion is a seed of hope for many, it has reaped a disproportional amount of death and destruction throughtout the world for millenia....

Whats your perspective on such??,,...

PS.. NO offence intended ..... just being honest>>>>>>>>>>

by Ciaron - Dublin Catholic Worker & Pitstop Ploughshares Wed Jul 21, 2004 14:07 087 918 4552 or 01- 492 6100

Man in the Street "But I'm not Catholic!"
Catholic Workers "No problem, we're not workers!"

The prophecy we have enacted is a 3,000 year old Jewish one to "beat swords into ploughshares". We did this in solidarity with predominantly Muslims under fire from predominantly Christian soldiers. It's a universal prophecy and if you can meet us on a basis of nonviolence, come on down and join the walk to court.

Folks who have accompanied us to court have included pagans, muslims, agnostics, athiests, Buddhists, anarcho-punks, Wombles, Catholic priests & nuns & laity, socialists, Greens, Republicans, academics, pensioners, Kiwis, Brits, Aussies, Hungarians, Poles, americans, Chileans, homeless folks,.buskers etc.

by protest...ant Wed Jul 21, 2004 11:04

Or even non-believing hedons for that matter or are places reserved for only those of good auld catholic faith???,.....amen