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The Saker
A bird's eye view of the vineyard

offsite link Alternative Copy of thesaker.is site is available Thu May 25, 2023 14:38 | Ice-Saker-V6bKu3nz
Alternative site: https://thesaker.si/saker-a... Site was created using the downloads provided Regards Herb

offsite link The Saker blog is now frozen Tue Feb 28, 2023 23:55 | The Saker
Dear friends As I have previously announced, we are now “freezing” the blog.? We are also making archives of the blog available for free download in various formats (see below).?

offsite link What do you make of the Russia and China Partnership? Tue Feb 28, 2023 16:26 | The Saker
by Mr. Allen for the Saker blog Over the last few years, we hear leaders from both Russia and China pronouncing that they have formed a relationship where there are

offsite link Moveable Feast Cafe 2023/02/27 ? Open Thread Mon Feb 27, 2023 19:00 | cafe-uploader
2023/02/27 19:00:02Welcome to the ‘Moveable Feast Cafe’. The ‘Moveable Feast’ is an open thread where readers can post wide ranging observations, articles, rants, off topic and have animate discussions of

offsite link The stage is set for Hybrid World War III Mon Feb 27, 2023 15:50 | The Saker
Pepe Escobar for the Saker blog A powerful feeling rhythms your skin and drums up your soul as you?re immersed in a long walk under persistent snow flurries, pinpointed by

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Public Inquiry
Interested in maladministration. Estd. 2005

offsite link RTEs Sarah McInerney ? Fianna Fail?supporter? Anthony

offsite link Joe Duffy is dishonest and untrustworthy Anthony

offsite link Robert Watt complaint: Time for decision by SIPO Anthony

offsite link RTE in breach of its own editorial principles Anthony

offsite link Waiting for SIPO Anthony

Public Inquiry >>

Human Rights in Ireland
Promoting Human Rights in Ireland

Human Rights in Ireland >>

Lockdown Skeptics

The Daily Sceptic

offsite link Why Do Experts Think That Talking About Racism a Lot is Going to Reduce Rather Than Increase Racism? Wed Feb 05, 2025 07:00 | James Alexander
How are we going to get rid of racism when we have expects and intellectuals paid to find us guilty of racism at all costs? The answer is never, says Prof James Alexander.
The post Why Do Experts Think That Talking About Racism a Lot is Going to Reduce Rather Than Increase Racism? appeared first on The Daily Sceptic.

offsite link News Round-Up Wed Feb 05, 2025 01:58 | Richard Eldred
A summary of the most interesting stories in the past 24 hours that challenge the prevailing orthodoxy about the ?climate emergency?, public health ?crises? and the supposed moral defects of Western civilisation.
The post News Round-Up appeared first on The Daily Sceptic.

offsite link Starmer Hands Prisoners 6.6% Pay Rise at Cost of ?4.4 Million Tue Feb 04, 2025 19:00 | Will Jones
Keir Starmer has handed prisoners a 6.6% pay rise at a cost of ?4.4 million despite depriving 10 million pensioners of their winter fuel allowance because money is so tight.
The post Starmer Hands Prisoners 6.6% Pay Rise at Cost of ?4.4 Million appeared first on The Daily Sceptic.

offsite link EU Plans to Let States Deport Failed Asylum Seekers and Criminals in Reform to Refugee Convention Tue Feb 04, 2025 17:00 | Will Jones
The EU is drawing up a plan to overhaul its 1951 Refugee Convention that prevents countries from rejecting asylum seekers at their borders in a belated effort to address Europe's exploding migrant crisis.
The post EU Plans to Let States Deport Failed Asylum Seekers and Criminals in Reform to Refugee Convention appeared first on The Daily Sceptic.

offsite link How Afraid Should we be About the Government?s Plan to Come up With a Legal Definition of ?Islamopho... Tue Feb 04, 2025 15:00 | Sam Bidwell
The prosecution of a man for burning the Qur'an shows how Islamic blasphemy codes are becoming embedded in criminal law. Coming up with a legal definition of 'Islamophobia' will accelerate this process, says Sam Bidwell.
The post How Afraid Should we be About the Government?s Plan to Come up With a Legal Definition of ?Islamophobia?? Very Afraid appeared first on The Daily Sceptic.

Lockdown Skeptics >>

Middle East Roadmap Doomed But Not Because of Israel

category national | miscellaneous | news report author Tuesday May 27, 2003 13:01author by Avi H. Report this post to the editors

It is commonly misreported in the media that Israel is not committed fully to the road map out of spite. No so, it's just that we have been down this road before - the failed Oslo Accords. So what's new? Not a lot.

On Sunday, the Sharon cabinet accepted in principle the road map — the first-ever Israeli governmental acceptance of a proposed Palestinian state in the West Bank and Gaza. The Israelis and Palestinians now begin the first effort to reach a settlement since the collapse of the Oslo process nearly three years ago.

The "Roadmap to a Permanent Two-State Solution to the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict" is an ambitious three-stage plan that calls for an end to terror attacks and a settlement freeze in the first stage, a Palestinian state with temporary borders in the second, and a final-status agreement by 2005.

We've been down this road before. And as we commence this new process, it is vital to recall the most recent, failed effort to achieve a two-state solution, the Oslo Accords.

What went wrong with Oslo?

The Oslo Accords had four main principles and each failed:

1) Oslo called for a Palestinian leadership that denounced violence and showed fiscal and diplomatic responsibility. However, Arafat expanded the terror, extorted funding, and continued to deny Israel's legitimacy.

2) Oslo called for dismantling of all terror organisations, like Hamas and Islamic Jihad, and the confiscation of illegal weapons. In fact, the leaders of these groups were actually empowered by release from Palestinian prisons, entry to official office, smuggling of illegal weapons (Karine A), and the funneling of arms to terror factions.

3) Oslo called for ending incitement to violence, and education of the Palestinian population for peace. In fact, the P.A. used their media and textbooks to deny Israel's legitimacy, incite for the killing of Jews, and call for "holy war."

4) Oslo presumed that violations would trigger the cessation of the process. Despite explicit Palestinian violations, Israel continued to pursue the Oslo vision, ceding additional land at Wye in 1998, and presenting a deal at Camp David in July 2000 that far exceeded previous offers.

To understand the current road map, one must understand its testing ground, Oslo.

--- ISRAEL'S CONCERNS ---

Given the painful Oslo backdrop, Israel has raised 14 objections to the wording of the road map, objections Bush has pledged to address "fully and seriously"; the Israeli cabinet's endorsement of the road map on Sunday was contingent upon the full implementation of these concerns. This time around, the Israelis say, it must be different.

The 14 objections (aside from the Palestinian refugee issue) may be grouped into four main sections, remarkably similar to those that caused Oslo's downfall:

1) The emerging of a new and reformed Palestinian government. Indeed, President Bush called on the Palestinian people to elect leaders "not compromised by terror" as a precondition for the road map. The inference was clear to all — Yasser Arafat must go.

Enter Prime Minister Abu Mazen last month, and the road map was launched.

Yet just last week, Abu Mazen himself stated to an Egyptian weekly: "Arafat is at the top of the [Palestinian] Authority. He's the man to whom we refer, regardless of the American or Israeli view of him... We do not do anything without his approval."

2) The full dismantling of terror organizations. Yet no arrests have been made, and no illegal weapons have been confiscated. Meanwile, suicide bombings and missile attacks on Israeli cities continue apace, and just last week the Israeli Navy captured a Gaza-bound fishing boat carrying explosives, instructions for assembly, and a Hizbullah terror expert.

As recently as March, Abu Mazen legitimized the use of violence and terror: "The Intifada must continue. And it is the right of the Palestinian people to rise and to use all means at their disposal... all means even guns..." (A-Sharq Al Awsat, March 3, 2003)

3) The cessation of incitement against Israelis from official Palestinian sources. Yet lately, the PA has broadcast these "music videos": a) Actors portraying a fictitious torture of a Palestinian prisoner by an Israeli soldier; b) Actors portraying Israelis in Nazi-like activities, like IDF soldiers murdering an elderly Palestinian man by shooting him in the head, and a Palestinian mother and infant blown up by soldiers; c) Encouraging young children to throw stones at Israelis, while smashing Jewish symbols.

4) Full performance of each stage — monitored objectively — to serve as a condition for continuation. Is the road map's preconceived timeline realistic? According to the road map, May 2003 is the deadline for implementation of "Phase One": Ending terror and violence, normalizing Palestinian life, and building Palestinian institutions. Yet none of this has even begun. Does anyone seriously expect it all to be accomplished in the next three days?

The endorsement of the road map on Sunday indicated that Ariel Sharon — generally vilified as a "hard-liner" — is now leading his country toward concessions for peace. Yet Sharon insists that this be predicated on a pragmatic, intelligent approach that avoids the four main problems that doomed Oslo.

Remarkably, many media outlets nonetheless have found plenty of room for censuring Israel's endorsement of the road map.

 #   Title   Author   Date 
   ¿am i on the right road?     saul    Tue May 27, 2003 13:07 
   Hi     Hi    Tue May 27, 2003 13:24 
   The Irish     The Knowledge    Tue May 27, 2003 13:24 
   Hi     pat c    Tue May 27, 2003 13:29 
   NOTHING is going to stop 'terrorism'     Mike    Tue May 27, 2003 13:50 
   Actually....     Salah    Tue May 27, 2003 13:59 
   In response to Mike - 'Nothing is going to stop terrorism'     Anonymous    Tue May 27, 2003 14:09 
   Fair play     Sean    Tue May 27, 2003 14:09 
   Putting the cart before the horse     kokomero    Tue May 27, 2003 14:15 
 10   spake jahweh thus:     Jehovah    Tue May 27, 2003 14:48 
 11   5th June: International Solidarity Day with Palestine     Sean    Tue May 27, 2003 14:51 
 12   42% of 80% of 22% of 100% is excellent.     saul not yet paul    Tue May 27, 2003 14:52 
 13   Non-logic     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 15:00 
 14   Avi     pat c    Tue May 27, 2003 15:09 
 15   Not a valid argument     kokomero    Tue May 27, 2003 15:20 
 16   Containing Islamic Terrorists     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 15:58 
 17   We're on a roadmap to nowhere     Yossarian    Tue May 27, 2003 16:41 
 18   !     Gaillimhed    Tue May 27, 2003 16:45 
 19   But what have you done?     Sean    Tue May 27, 2003 16:55 
 20   To make a valid point     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 17:03 
 21   Closures and hardship     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 17:07 
 22   but...     David C.    Tue May 27, 2003 17:44 
 23   Why no answer avi?     Yossarian    Tue May 27, 2003 17:55 
 24   Who says it's their land?     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 17:55 
 25   More Avi rubbish     yossarian    Tue May 27, 2003 18:33 
 26   Pat, define what you mean by 'attacks'     Mike    Tue May 27, 2003 18:37 
 27   Natural Justice and Jews     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 18:39 
 28   Exactly     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 18:45 
 29   To make a valid point     .    Tue May 27, 2003 18:57 
 30   TO AVI     -    Tue May 27, 2003 18:57 
 31   YOU HAVE TO GO INTO AN TAISCE MODE     -ººº    Tue May 27, 2003 18:57 
 32   SO HE GETS THE MESSAGE     º    Tue May 27, 2003 18:57 
 33   Avi     Justin Moran    Tue May 27, 2003 18:59 
 34   Avi     Justin Moran    Tue May 27, 2003 19:00 
 35   Yes. All sides should be heard...     David C.    Tue May 27, 2003 19:02 
 36   By the way...     David C.    Tue May 27, 2003 19:04 
 37   Points     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 19:09 
 38   David C.     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 19:20 
 39   a land without people?     David C.    Tue May 27, 2003 19:54 
 40   really old lies     Palmiro Togliatti    Tue May 27, 2003 19:59 
 41   History     Avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 20:07 
 42   And another thing     Avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 20:14 
 43   the central question...     David C.    Tue May 27, 2003 20:42 
 44   The claim     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 20:54 
 45   Another question... (I'm feeling lucky)     Yossarian    Tue May 27, 2003 20:56 
 46   and one more thing...     David C.    Tue May 27, 2003 21:00 
 47   David C.     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 21:11 
 48   The claim     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 21:16 
 49   that is just not true...     David C.    Tue May 27, 2003 21:29 
 50   No the claim is much more complex than that     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 21:35 
 51   OF COURSE they do (have a right to resist)     Mike    Tue May 27, 2003 21:49 
 52   ...how complex can it be?     David C.    Tue May 27, 2003 21:53 
 53   Please read up on it yourself     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 21:58 
 54   excellent suggestion....     David C.    Tue May 27, 2003 22:26 
 55   242     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 22:50 
 56   land     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 22:54 
 57   reply to Mike     Palmiro Togliatti    Tue May 27, 2003 22:59 
 58   Hmmmmm...     David C    Tue May 27, 2003 23:22 
 59   Security     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 23:35 
 60   Palestinian State     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 23:36 
 61   Our borders     avi H.    Tue May 27, 2003 23:39 
 62   terrorism?     David C    Tue May 27, 2003 23:46 
 63   I never     avi H.    Wed May 28, 2003 00:02 
 64   Oslo and terrorism     avi H.    Wed May 28, 2003 00:05 
 65   Palestinian State     avi H.    Wed May 28, 2003 00:09 
 66   'The German word'     David C.    Wed May 28, 2003 00:26 
 67   I take it as a veiled insult     avi H.    Wed May 28, 2003 03:20 
 68   It's in your head     avi H.    Wed May 28, 2003 03:23 
 69   Waiting for Godot: Text of resolution 242 ... passed 36 years ago!     kokomero    Wed May 28, 2003 13:34 
 70   No Palmiro     Mike    Wed May 28, 2003 14:20 
 71   truth is not an insult...     David C    Wed May 28, 2003 15:32 
 72   last night     iosaf    Wed May 28, 2003 16:51 
 73   I refuse to be 'sensitive' about telling the truth.     avi H.    Wed May 28, 2003 17:01 
 74   Much more fun on Vancouver Indymedia     They need new editors    Wed May 28, 2003 22:47 
 75   2 roads : Kuwait vs. West-bank     kokomero    Thu May 29, 2003 10:06 
 76   It's a stupid comparison     avi H.    Thu May 29, 2003 11:18 
 77   Exactly what are you denying Avi     kokomero    Thu May 29, 2003 11:52 
 78   By the way your excuse is PATHETIC because     kokomero    Thu May 29, 2003 11:57 
 79   Really, really stupid points,     avi H.    Thu May 29, 2003 17:03 
 80   Stop avoiding the issue Avi and answer the questions!     kokomero    Thu May 29, 2003 18:13 
 81   Expect an answer     Yossarian    Thu May 29, 2003 21:19 
 82   The process will fail because of Europe's disinterest and Israels obstructionism     kokomero    Fri May 30, 2003 07:12 


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