'My name is David and I am homeless.'

by R Isible Thu May 15, 2003 23:58

Have there been any organisations that are useful? Also (and this sounds like a stupid question so sorry) is the picture on this post of you?

by Dave Donnellan Fri May 16, 2003 07:01 daviddonnellan at eircom dot net

David is not a computer user but I have promised I would relay any comments back to him and yes it is his photo.

by Gaillimhed Fri May 16, 2003 11:09

Davids story reminds me of Orwells book, 'Down and out in paris and london', it appears that nothing in our society has really changed (excet in appearance) since the thirties when Orwell wrote of his own experiences of homelessness and vagrancy. An important thing to remember is how easy it is to fall throught the cracks, as easy now as it was then, a few turns of bad luck in the right circumstances and thats IT, youre fucked, and once youre down its totally stacked against you. And it can happen to practically anyone -thats the thing people like seamus (above post, probably deleted by now) never seem to grasp.
Im delighted to hear things are on the mend for you David, good luck for the future.

by Geoff Fri May 16, 2003 12:43

The Focus coffeeshop on Eustace St. in temple bar seems to be a pretty good resource for information & help, as well as a hot meal. They publish lists of private rented houses & will let people use their phones. Also have pretty good info. about courses & stuff. Not much but considering that the services for homeless people in Dublin are so inadquate and under funded (lots of cash thrown at organisations & bureaucrats, not enought in bricks & morter) it might be worth checking out.

by Rob Fri May 16, 2003 14:23

Personnally I have a major problem with giving money to people begging on streets of any city in Ireland. It supports the problem which causes those unfortunate enough to find themselves in that position. That is an acceptance of dependance on other people. I personnally have not ever found myself in a position where I have nowhere to turn, so yeah pity about me, what would I know? I know that there are people I do give money to on the streets, but it is always restricted to those who show a clear determination to fight back against a society based on dependance, and claim their existence as their own. To those who do not condemn themselves to absolute reliance. In Davids story above he says maybe I should have known better, and yes I do believe he should have to begin with. Then when he found himself in the unfortunate position of being without home or means to climb back he turned to dependance once more, once again I believe he should have known better, there are other options.

Human nature is such that we hold an aversion towards people who give up. Unfortunately this is the reality of street begging; it is acceptance of failure - those in such situations may not quite know what it is they have failed, but the projected message is failure, cop out, drop out, alco, drug addict . . . the list is endless. That is the image created by absolute dependance. The major point which need to be communicated is that homeless people find themselves in a unique position. They have been rejected by society, to a certain extent that is. They are in a way outside of it. Those who turn to begging are subjecting themselves to the exact same system of living as all of us who have jobs and rely on weekly wage, begging after all is a full time job, the absence of which - at least in this case - resulted in homelessness. But some do not rely on the pity vote, and these are the ones I support. They make their "home" - our streets - a more interesting place, they confront us with their story, and through street art, music, storytelling - and there are many other ways . . . They are in a position to observe our society from the gutter level inside of it, many of them have revealing things to say. Unfortunately few say anything, and often respond to those who do not pity them with the same mocking attiude frequently visited on them.

My attitude remains that of helping those who do not accept that they are useless, they often do deserve our pity, but not all rely upon it. And, no there is not enough help and support for those in these situations in Ireland. But we are not a poor country, there are ways and means of communicating a willingness to climb, begging does the opposite.

by Emma Fri May 16, 2003 14:32

I totally sympathise with your story, though that's all fine and dandy me saying that when I have no idea about being homeless and what it's actually like. Thanks for opening my eyes.

Also on a completely unrelated topic (this sounds so fickle and it wasnt the purpose of the article) but could you tell David he's very cute:P?

by the deserving poor Fri May 16, 2003 15:52

In that case, I would rather give my money to beggars and the homeless, rather than robbing thieving sponging incompetent corrupt councillors/politicians. Beggars seem to be altogether a more respectable and honest bunch of people.

by . Fri May 16, 2003 16:36

casas sin gente gente sin casas

by Rob Fri May 16, 2003 16:56

This issue began as something non-political. I realise, as do many others that politics and the consumer age has a hell of a lot to do with it. But guess what sunshine: the whole world is fucked up! We know that so get off your high horse and stop shouting arguments (that I would argue more or less everyone, including me, who reads Indymedia agrees with anyway - which is a terrible state of affairs . . . different argument different day) Anyway there are a host of reasons for the society we live in, but it's not going to change tomorrow. The problem as I see it is the attitudes circulating regarding homeless peoples in Ireland, and not just among the rich but among the homeless themselves. No-one is absolutely helpless but the fact remains many depend on our (and often their own) belief that they are.

Homelessness, begging, etc. was around long before capitalism, so stop politicising it, David didn't mention politics so who are you to alter his story and tell him how he wound up on the street through no fault of his own - THE DAMN GOVERNMENT DID IT. I can't think of anything constructive to say so I'll just insult some politicians . . . that won't get anyone anywhere, it's a cop out.

[p.s. David, I mean you no insult through anything I say, I do believe in the opinions I have laid out (as vague as they might be) but the problems reffer not to you but to a common attitude in our society which I believe is the cause of many of the problems you experienced. That society by the way includes everyone who lives in it and not just those in houses.]

by kitty-kat Fri May 16, 2003 17:31

Food Not Bombs!!!!

i'm so so bloody glad this article has been posted. About time. well done Dave, i'm sure it is not an easy thing to do, knowing the topic is so contentious and experiencing it first hand, i'm sure it's no easy thing to sit down and write about it for public scrutiny.

i don't think begging is an acceptance of failure. in some cases it is a necessity plain and simple, in others it is not. this term "failure" is a very subjective one and i don't think it has any place in the discussion other than to ackowledge the fact that society at large (yes, you and I) have failed. the capitalist systems was one loooong baaaaaaaad experiment and we each need to look around our community and see what needs doing.

So how about a roof for everybodies head and food for everybodies belly? there is no reason why it should be (is) any other way.

[email protected]

by Phuq Hedd Fri May 16, 2003 18:06

I agree with Kitty-kat, begging isn't wrong and it isn't an acceptance of failure it's a pragmatic attempt to continue life.

However, back to David's story. It's a straighforward account of the problems that people without a large financial cushion face. It would seem that our society makes no provision for people that have low funds and no immediate prospects of a job.

It's hard for me to know whether or not this story is the real deal, there's no way for me to tell who David is or Dave Donnellan, but it strikes me as authentic and believable.

It certainly agrees with some of the findings of Focus: http://www.focusireland.ie/htm/housing_homelessness/fi_research/index.htm

Further back on that website there's some useful discussion of different types of homelessness and near homelessness.

I'd say that Rob can take the position that he does as long as he ensures that there are mechanisms in place to avoid situations like David's.

If Rob is certain of that, then he's merely choosing to exercise his personal selfishness (his right), if he's not, then he's attempting to give a moral veneer to his participation in a rotten society.

by David Rynne Fri May 16, 2003 20:10

I know it's horrible to say this, but a walk through the city center has become a guilt trip, people on every corner asking for spare change. If you have anything in your pocket you feel guilty cause they only ask for 50c, but just because i have change doesn't mean it's spare. I have got no income, I live on debt to put me through college, every penny i earn goes into paying back loans and i borrow a lot of money from my parents to keep me going.
Maybe if the beggers had a sign saying "ask me why i'm here" and they actually encouraged people to hear their stories then awareness would increase and they'd get more sympathy. I know that's not a real solution.... it's a fucked up world

by - Sat May 17, 2003 11:43

Begging is a concept crystalised in Irish society by the Mid nineteenth Vagrancy Act enacted in the immediate aftermath of the Great Irish Famine as a means to control the congestion of urban areas with recently dispossesed poor.
google terms: "An Gort Mhor".
Begging as in the non-licensed practise of asking for financial aid in a public space.
(without showing means of support).

In the final years of the 20th century begging laws were re-cut in many European states to further define new concepts of dispossession.
Terms such as "agressive begging" came into vogue.

Okup@ció!

by Ex-homelss person Sun May 18, 2003 16:46

The media seems to overuse the term "homless prson" as if these people were a different species. They're just people with an accomodation problem, not some strange lower caste who were born into this state.

Many are well educated and held professional white collar jobs before some concatenation of calamities or mental illness brought them difficulties in accomodation.

Stop the labelling like "handicapped", "homeless" is the the start of fixing this problem.

by Mark Doris Sun May 18, 2003 17:47

That's a great piece and a very good photo: leading-edge journalism! Congrats to David and friends who helped put it up here.

by the deserving poor Sun May 18, 2003 23:40

'The begging market is flooded'? it would also appear that beggars come in a variety of forms,but at least street beggars have the decency and unfrontedness to ask politely for their money unlike whinging waster student scum like David rhinehun, who spongingly drains our taxes, to finance his hell raising happy go lucky 'student' lifestyle.

by Rupert watkins Sun May 18, 2003 23:43

I am a student, i hate to see smelly beggars in the street. My daddykins and mummykins and the government and tax payers money funds my fun student lifestyle.

by Pippa O horseface Sun May 18, 2003 23:47

I'm cash strapped student, although I have the money to go out boozing every night, vandalising local property and making as much nuisance and disturbance as possible, luckily the kind police just dismiss our vandalism and disturbance of the peace as privilleged student hijinks. I can't stand smelly beggars too.

by Deirdre Clancy - Catholic Worker Mon May 19, 2003 13:10 dee_clancy at yahoo dot co dot uk

David, thanks for the piece; it was courageous and enlightening. It's so easy for anyone to fall through the net; a corrupt employer is not your fault. Plenty of people I know have been in corrupt work situations; I know someone who did a Fas film course, for example, and discovered that the person supposed to be teaching was using Fas funding to make their own feature film. We live in a country of brown envelopes and people turning a blind eye to incredible corruption, and the people who suffer, as the businesspeople line their pockets, are not catered for by the structures of society.

Rob, your comments are deeply offensive. How dare anyone suggest that those living on the streets in all weathers are obliged to entertain you with their often painful stories, be they of hard luck or betrayal by the system, or to entertain you with street theatre when they don't know where they are going to lay their heads that night? If a homeless person chooses (or has enough energy) to tell a story or entertain for funds, then fine, but society's marginalised are not there to entertain and amuse patronising and smug idiots who want to be the king to their court jester. This lifestyle can wreak havoc with a person's health, both mental and physical, and it's stressful enough living on the streets without feeling the need to act the ham for arrogant gobshites, who can't see the flaws in our system that allow things like homelessness to grow and perpetuate.

by Leon - no more windfarms Mon May 19, 2003 17:06 nomorewindfarms at yahoo dot com

Excellent journalism.

People who are down on their luck are not there to entertain us. They aren't a different species.

We are all 2 paychecks away from the gutter.

by aspiring squatter Mon May 19, 2003 20:39 squatthechurches at yahoo dot co dot uk

Irelands problem with homelessness is getting worse by the minute from what i can see and the government obviously doesnt care,never has and never will.Seems to me that there is a wealth of abandoned property in dublin that could be squatted like in so many other countries.

It might be a bit hard in Dublin as property prices are so high and things are rarely left unoccupied for long but everywhere else in the country there seems to be many many properties left abandoned that could be changed into homes.

I know there is certain laws that make squatting in ireland that bit more difficult than in england lets say but maybe that can be changed if numbers get involved.Anyway i was just wondering if anyone would be interested in gettin a squatters advice association together in ireland like they have in england to print out information about the subject etc .. ?

let me know ,
[email protected]

by CiaranM Tue May 20, 2003 09:04

I was thinking the same thing last time I was walking down James street, past the brewery. There were rows of abandoned shops and housing - seemed like decent squatting potential, but I never heard of squatters anywhere in Dublin.
There used to be quite a few squatters where I used to live in Belfast, but that was before the peace process boom (anyone remember that?), so I don't know the state of it all now - they were probably forced out. I guess you were referring to the South though.

And whats with all the anti-student wank? Fair enough yer man was talking through his arse and there is a good share of spoiled D4 tossers posing as students, but don't be painting them all with the same brush. Whats wrong with adults who work hard, many living with debt for years to support their education, getting pissed a couple times a week? By the same reasoning unemployed people on the dole shouldn't be allowed to have a drink or go to the cinema or buy chips.... Isn't a social life a right for evryone, regardless of their circumstances?

by Anonymous Tue May 20, 2003 15:49

Great article. Homelessness in a reasonably prosporous country such as Ireland is an absolute disgrace.

I have spoken to many homeless people like Dave over the years and have heard very similar genuine stories.

If I was a politican and saw people forced to live on the street (don't ask me how they do it), I would be going mental.

How Bertie and Fianna Fail can comtemplate spending One Billion Euro on a football stadium when we already have a magnificant stadium in Croke Park available - the mind boggles.

The problem should be solved by normal means but since the government is clearly not going to do this - could they do something like using postage stamps as a form of advertising for companies and use the revenue generated from this to tackle homelessness.

A crude, ugly and capitalist method I know - but I would much prefer to see Coca-Cola postage stamps coming into me rather than to have even ONE person forced to sleep and live on the streets. I'm sure Dave would too.

by Sandra Smith Tue May 20, 2003 17:35 sanmclarke at hotmail dot com

I volunteered with the Simon Community a few years ago (I'm now living in Australia). I worked on the soup patrol. I totally believe your tale about the police as I had a run-in one very cold winters night with the Pearse Street station trying to get a woman,who had only recently come out of hospital and was still very sick, and her husband (both homeless) to allow them spend a night in the station. The policeman's attitude sickened me. The woman, by the way, died a few weeks after that incident, alone in a car park.

The people I met were just like you and me. It is so easy to judge, my friends, whilst you sit in your comfortable homes.

I noticed that there isn't anyone who has offered Dave a room or somewhere to stay?

by Rob has a point! Tue May 20, 2003 21:22

One correspondent said the Dublin homeless problem was akin to New Delhi. Please, get real. Every city, every country; wherever you go there's homeless people.

Begging is not the answer. It throws oxygen to the homeless person; it extends the length of time in which they can wallow in self-pity; it sustains them in their miserable existence.

Nobody should have to be homeless: there is supports there for those who know to avail of it.

Without criticising Dave, I do wonder why he did not visit the British embassy? Surely he could have been given identification which he could have used to get a job, for there are jobs out there, or if that failed claim dole? The bottom line is that begging = taking the easy option.

It is throwing your tragedy in someone else's face, saying: 'I am helpless' when the reality is the opposite. Like a junkie or an alcoholic, the homless person has to stop wallowing in self pity, stop begging on the streets, utilise the supports which are available. They have to make a conscious decision to say "I've had enough of being homeless."

That's what Dave did and well done him for making that decision.

There is tragedy everywhere. Homelessness in one of the more visible ones because it's on our streets every day, it wants our money, it begs off us and we feed it.

We're the ones who keep the beggers in business. And as I look around me, that's what I see- the exploitation of the collective middle class conscience.

To people like Dave who have made the conscious decision to dig themselves out of the hole, well done!

by David O shoulderpads Tue May 20, 2003 21:37

Yes I agree with Rob's sentiments entirely, these smelly beggars are spoiling the look of luxury executive developments, we professionals in Ireland are struggling to create a skyline similar to the glossy fronted skylines in uber capitalist cities like Dallas etc. We really don't need dirty homeless people spoiling this view. They just bring the tone of the whole place down. A sophisticated western country like Ireland shouldn't have beggars ruining our image. I have many executive clients from the UK and US and they are disgusted having to run the gauntlet of smelly beggars, we're having to avoid the dirty fingerprints of beggars clawing at our slick Gucci designer suits. We who have to endure executive stress in our high powered professional lifestyles, the last thing we want to be reminded of is the stench of poverty and beggars, so please please take your unwashed ragged bodies away.

by Righteous Pragmatist Wed May 21, 2003 10:14

David is a hardluck case. He has had a long series of knocks and people like him who have fallen through all the safety nets can only deserve our sympathy and charity.
The only solution is for tax breaks to be given to landlords to encourage them to allow previously homeless people temporary accommodation. The homeless people are given a social welfare allowance and is directed toward educational programmes which can give them access to employment. This is only provided if the homeless person so wishes and is conditional that the homeless person shows a commitment to the programme and must finish it according to deadlines. The programme would after all be funded by taxpayers who do not have bottomless pockets themselves. If the homeless person avails of the chance given him then he has some way of making his own way in the competitive world.
If he/she does not avail of it or tries to abuse it by making it their permanent occupation then they should be weeded out of the programme and some other homeless person more ambitious and deserving given the chance instead.
Charity is all that you can expect from people who have stable settled working lives otherwise.
If a homeless person does want to better him/herself then it is the duty of society to help that person on condition that the result is that they help themselves. If the homeless person does not avail of the chance to end their misery it is not the responsibility of anyone to give them anything but charity.
I would hope sincerely that all homeless people would get of the trap but society as a hole can only do so much.

by Phuq Hedd Wed May 21, 2003 16:51

landlords are taxed incredibly heavily as are the upper and middle classes. Especially high taxes are put upon landlords. This will decrease interest in speculation upon housing which will result in lower land prices.

Then the money is used to build more houses which will mean that David has a chance of somewhere to live.

by Sarah Thu May 22, 2003 11:50 pikeyprincess2001 at yahoo dot com

Hi David, i hope by now you are well on your way to sorting your life out.
It breaks my heart to hear about sad stories such as yours.
I suffer from depression on and off for years, and sometimes i think that my life is absolutely terrible.
But compared to yours mine is idyllic.

I don't always give money to beggars because i don't always have it but when i can i do. I incur the wrath of my sister and boyfriend when i do, but ever since i was little i've not been able to resist sharing what little i have with those less well off. We've all suffered from poverty, and i think that it effects people in different ways. I just remember that Jesus never had much cash and always kept the company of people who were unencumbered by material possessions, such as yourself.

People are very quick to judge and i am no different in my own way. We are all given a set of circumstances at birth and these can change. Also i know from depression, that it is all very well to tell someone to pull themselves together. Those people who are insensitive to the suffering of others have bigger issues, and if the laws of karma work, will soon find out what it is all about.

I don't think i am in much of a position to help, other than to send you lots of blessings, positive thoughts and to wish you lots of happiness for the future.

Happiness is however, not based on material possessions, though we are all entitled to a basic quality of life, and that should not be denied anyone.

all the best,
love Sarah

by iosaf remembers. Thu May 22, 2003 12:05

what pray tell rightous pragmatist are they?
we sometimes use them in Okupes for flying trapeze but at a hieght of more than 7 metres.
do explain.....

by bernie bird Sun May 25, 2003 06:17 berniejbird at yahoo dot ie

Howaya David et al,
I've been homeless full time since 1997 with a few short interludes of tenancy since. I'm from Dublin, finished 2ndary school and a coupla years college and then went mad and started living rough- cant handle anymore crooked landlords, stiff routined pub and shop cynic culture, wage slavery future and precious lost life experience time. Yeah, I've suffered for my choices, I've slept in parks- I've made compromises also, I worked for IBM for a few months (and missed sleeping in parks)...
What's my input? OK, I've lived rough all these years with strict rules- NEVER HAVE I BEGGED, CHEATED OR STOLEN... and you know what? the right intentions come back around!
I've reclaimed trash, recycled food out of the backs of supermarkets, lived itinerary as a roofer, built houses up trees where no person can kick me awake in the morning, squatted empty offices, worked on peoples gardens and taken short jobs on farms and even once, as I like to relate, frequented old furniture dumps to search down the backs of discarded sofas for loose change! (and that, believe it or not, kept me in beer quite a while!).
I'm not trying to bring you down, David, I've been where you are... My point is that you have to appreciate your place as your CHOICE, and that you can as easily change your situation with an amount of that wit and resourcefulness you have that keeps you alive day to day- experiment with it and draw new rules... start maybe seeing how you can help others as well as them helping you...
I know Dublin is rough, I'm in New York now and it's a float compared to trying to pay rent where you are... maybe that's what you need, a different pace, a new quality and appreciation of living... can't handle the way things are? Then I'll advice- change it! Get a bunch of other street people together and get reactionary- squat the empty space, raid the waste, fuck it and camp on the steps of the Dail en masse, be sure when the next Garda comes about there's several of you waiting... and well, if that doesn't work out and you're on your own, move on- it isn't the place for you...
If you need mor info- write me...
keep it real,
b. bird

by caspian Tue May 27, 2003 19:43

Hurrah for bernie Bird! Being homeless doesn't have to be a life of misery. Like bernie I spent a few years bumming around various countries and one can always find somehwere to eat for free without having to beg. Casual work is everywhere and I used to scrabble around in the grass behind benches in the parks. You could always find a few bob that had fallen out of peoples pockets. The Hari Krishnas will give you a graet vegetarian meal twice a day for free in most major cities.
Another point. Dave mentions the thug that was ripping him off in the hostel. Would that be the Iveagh Hostel? Is it still there? A horrible place that should be investigated. I was roughing it in Dublin 15 years ago and stayed at this hovel for a few weeks. I was better off sleeping in the park! The place was run by a bunch of thugs. All ex-residents who had been given power over the unfortunate inmates. The food was inedible and I used to sneak into the Salvation Army hostel in York Street to get a decent meal.
There was another Dickensian hostel across the river that used to terrify me. Huge place. Is it still there? The residents were treated like animals. What is it about the Irish wjhen they are put in charge of institutions whether it be Christian brothers, nuns and their laundries. orphanages or hostels for the homeless. They turn into vicious tyrants.
Who runs the Iveagh hostel? Perhaps if they have a website they should be bombarded with protests.

by Paul McCarthy Wed May 28, 2003 10:12 paulmccarthy2002 at eircom dot net http://maccap.blogspot.com/ 0876182453

As an only child myself his story really rang true. As my parents get older I often wonder if I too could end up on the streets and fall through the net.

I hope that David finds the advice on treating homelessness as treating homelessness as a lifestyle choice useful. I'd hazard a guess that it may be dispiriting. In the same way that some people are highly motivated and entrepreneurial , we all know at least one person who is going to make a success of anything they turn their had to, others are not.

Could someone post information regarding the squatting laws in Ireland. In 'Fences and Windows' Naomi Klein has some articles detailing how the homeless in Canada's main cities were politicised, squatted, protested and even occupied the offices of the civil servants in the housing departments. Would a series of protests outside the Dail and the Dublin Civic Office be possible? Imagine blocking the Dails exits or the central area of and car parks with mattresses and temporary shelters. This would be a media event and would help humanise the people that are usually talked about as a homogenous mass. Do people think this idea is a runner or would be interested in organising it?

by Kathleen Nicole Wed May 28, 2003 19:34 lady_unkind_ at hotmail dot com 22-389953

I have a something that in my opinion should be done already. The government of all countries should choose some restaurants that will have food for homeless people, provided of course by the government, at particular hours of the day; or houses even that could endow with beds, for a night maybe or something.
There are lots of people that are kind and human on this planet. We should be generalizing based to them and not the little stone hearted.
And if we all try giving little of what we have things CAN get better.
If you think that meanness gives you strength, wait and see what kindness can do.

by Josef Sun Jun 01, 2003 16:09

.....are alcoholics and drug users. Don't waste your charity on them.

by citizen Sun Jun 01, 2003 18:07

interesting opinion about the "exploitation of the middle class conscience" by those lazy, self pitying homeless whiners.bring on the violins!! the whole society is being exploited by a system based on self serving cronyism and betrayal of (nearly) the entire population.the exploitation is being carried out by those who squander our taxes on egocentric projects and the lining of their own pockets.we are being exploited by a government that questions our right to exist in a rights-based society.(irish times 24 may 2003). society should not be judged by the heights reached by the elite, but by just how far people can fall before the government actually does something about it.this is the exploitation that concerns me...

by Garret Sun Jun 01, 2003 19:04 gar at dublin dot com

How can Rob etc. so confidently and uniformly judge people who are addicted to drugs and alcohol? Also, many people end up on the streets due to mental illness (unlike Bernie Bird and Caspian).

Rob's "give us an old tune y' homeless scamp" attitude, of having an aversion to those who give up and don't join the legion of charming urchins he longs to see dance for their supper, is very close to Thatcherism or McDowellism. This is a political issue when it's the government dishing out the funds. McDowell argued recently against attempts to enshrine human rights (social and economic) into the constitution. He believes that these rights would be better decided by the likes of him and his cronies, who are doing such a wonderful job at present. Of course McDowell overlooks the fact that his retirement will be paid for by a fat state pension when he is old and vulnerable. We don't all get such pensions. McDowell spoke of the need for the "can do" attitude and warned (I kid you not) of a "rights based society" which he said would be a return to socialism. By the way, he made these comments when addressing the Institute of Management Consultants. The average person living on the dole lives on less a week than the average TD gets for his/her weekly car parking and staying in Dublin overnight allowances.

Bad things can happen to anyone. Things that knock them down for the count. These people (potentially Rob or the gobshite just above me) need our help to get back up fighting again.

By the way, to the 'Rob has a point' poster: Do you think it would be easy getting a job when you are homeless? And don't you know that you can't get the dole when you've no fixed abode.

Also, I don't get the hostility to David Rynnes 'ask me why I'm here' idea. This would help many people stop dehumanising the homeless. I think people like the anonymous Deserving Poor poster etc. should just ring into late night radio shows with their sad comments. And no, I'm not another student.

The squatter ideas are good but only if they were done on mass. I believe that groups like Simon don't go for the Canadian idea that features in Fences and Windows so it would be up to homeless people to initially get the ball rolling themselves.

by Garret Sun Jun 01, 2003 19:07 gar at dublin dot com

When I wrote gobshite just above me I meant gobshite just above the poster directly above me.

by Blue Man Mon Jun 02, 2003 18:00

Unfortunately there is no simple solution to homelessness. Many people who find themselves homeless in Dublin do have alcohol or drug addictions often aggravated by the pressures of homelessness. Two new hostels run by the De-Paul Trust have done a lot to help stop people sleeping rough, one is a 'wet' hostel which allows alcohol on the premises and the other is designed for heroin users.
Many homeless people use squats but will only tell a select few due to fear of evicition. More residential detox places are needed for homeless people who want to get off drink or drugs, more beds for couples (social welfare will not recognise a 'couple' if they met on the streets, they must have lived together for over 6 months!) and there is a need for a hostel for people new to homelessness and who do not have addiction problems... too often I've seen people with no addictions turn into heroin users or alcoholics in a matter of weeks or months. Here a few scandalous realities:

-It takes 1 year for a homeless person to get on methadone maintenance in the City Centre.
-Often over 1 year to get transitional housing
-3 years for corpo housing if you're lucky (I've met people who'ce been on the corpo waiting list for 9 years.)
-It's near impossible to get a detox programme off heroin without getting methadone maintenance first (hence dual addiction)
-It can take over 20 minutes to get through on the 'emergency' homeless freephone

I could rant some more but it won't make much difference especially with a fuckwit cronnie like Noel Ahern as Minister for housing.

by Jossef mengele Fri Jun 06, 2003 20:21

Most homeless people deserve to be homeless, because if they can't afford to buy a house and the government can't afford to build them a council house, then they deserve to be homeless for being poor. You can't expect the government to make a loss by investing money in council owned properties when they can make a quick profit selling council properties off to big buisness private property speculators. Tough shit if you weren't born with a silver spoon in your mouth. Get use to being poor, better still why don't homeless people just top themselves. The government should consider investing in euthansia services for poor/homeless people.

by Rory Browne - Humanity Wed Jun 18, 2003 11:27 rorybrowne at yahoo dot com

I am as irreverant as most, but publishing the profoundly 'humorous' comments of gobshites demeans this article and the subject. 'Homeless people are smelly' etc. Pure genius, fuckwits. Sort out your web page, screen the comments for sincerety or close your site.

by Saidhbhín Tue Jun 24, 2003 11:49

I am pleased to see this article published on the web, and while i understand why, I think it's a shame David has to explain at the start that it's not supposed to be a sob story. It is not a happy story either and he shouldn't have to apologise for telling it because people get scared before even reading it.
As has already been stated, many of us are only a pay cheque away, or a family member away from the same situation - most people have at some time or other had the fortune to have somebody to lean on when strapped for cash/stuck for a place to stay.
I know it sounds mundane, but I think people need education on homelessness in order to stop some of the basic abuse that goes on (such as throwing things at/pissing on/insulting people on the streets)and obviously more needs to be done in order to help people get the care they need, the advice they need and the education they need (in some cases obviously) in order to get a chance at living with their basic rights, which in my opinion includes not only dignity and respect but the right to a roof over their heads and a decent meal here and there.
Remember when the dole office gave away tins of corned beef and various surplus food products? Why can something like that not be organised again for the homeless action groups and agencies so that they can channel their resources into direct action and not waste their money on something that is just being thrown away anyway? And why are builder's prices rising so quickly? And why are hospitals and institutions not better funded so that they don't have to throw out people who are not ready to leave because they need the beds?
Basic questions that need to be answered.
In the mean time all you can do is the bit you can do. If you can afford to get involved. regarding dropping someone a few coins - well - you can't ask where the money goes - you either give or you don't. But ironically maybe, chances are it is less than the price of a pint you were gonna buy yourself....

by bernie bird Sun Jun 29, 2003 20:23 berniejbird at yahoo dot ie

Hello again all,
Looking back over my comment of a month ago, "Another Homeless Irish Chapee", I realize I may have (along with everyone else) been a little insensitive to David's plight... we all have answers for him, don't we?
There were times I have questioned myself, (living rough leaves plenty of time for introspection), something like "why can't I fit into society?"... other times I ask, "why should I fit into society?" and then watching the throngs of blank faces shuffling to and from work ask "why is society? why do they bother?", generally questions you'd think not many others ask, a perspective shared by few...
Somebody mentioned Orwell's "Down and Out", but the best book by far to explain the homeless experience I believe to be Knut Hamsuns "Hunger", of his experiences as a street bum in Copenhagen in the 1880's, a most unique vision of the mind of someone who is open to the world, exposed and vulnerable daily to the cruelties and scrutinies of the public, and seeing only a wall of impossibility for any normal life or any chance of reconforming out of the constant chaos...
incidentally, Hamsun became world famous, won a Nobel for Lit. in 1920, became a millionaire, joined the Nazi party, repented when he learned of the Holocaust and gave away all his money and died starving as a homeless bum...
Like also mentioned somewhere above... we're only a paycheck away...
So where's David now? There ought to be a follow up to this article of some kind, not that I expect to hear either way of a Lotto win or prison bars, but I would like to say I am concerned and interested and that he should not be feeling alone, he opened himself to us here for more genuine scrutiny, perhaps, so let's be good with him and encourage him to inform us further of the adventure of his life!
Hope yer well, bro,
b

by BornInIreland - FREEDOM Tue Jul 01, 2003 01:18

Contrary to belief we are not here to criticize one and other and as for those who do are making things worse.

If anyone truly cares about this situation then they would not have written the first idea that came into their minds and into heart. Try empathy before sympathy and not waste time squandering with apathy.

Now obviously most if not all have proven that this situation is strangely mis-understood.

If any of you care I will post again with a report concerning these matters and I do believe that though dropping some words of wisdom in this area may teach some, but what we forget to realize is.


Are we directly reaching any of the people we need to through these arguments? (If they can't afford a house can they view your post)?
.................................................

by smash Wed Jul 02, 2003 22:19

Friend keep your faith. Things are going to be better.

by Peter Gibson Fri Jul 11, 2003 18:09

I personally would be inclined to cause some form of revolution to emanate from the homeless community in Dublin. I use the word community because that is what they are and should recognise themselves as and a title they should use to their advantage. Storm a hostel (preferably that one where the worker stole their money and the conditions were akin to a slum) and take it over as a roof over your heads. Use the water, electricity and beds as (momentary) relief, and use the bricks, mortar and your solidarity as a tool to keep them.
Somebody will listen. Other Homeless people will listen and you never know something might happen.

by BornInIreland Sat Jul 12, 2003 03:45 rotik at aol dot com

I would like to make an update and address to my previous post. I said I will be laying some words down for the interested and the influenced.
I will. Firstly though, I feel this situation needs to be handled delicately and this is why I chose to split it in two.

1-to Liberate, this section.

2-Activate, next post.

The intentions for this one of course, is to liberate ourselves with away from the lesser of our opinions. This way we can be a true help to those who need it when the see we see as they do and know the out.

**********************LIBERATION*****************
I would like to first start by stating if others have not that there is a liberation in not owning a house, look we will all leave this earth eventually, what good is our house then? Will the house remain unoccupied? Will windows of the house grow mouths and speak English? Will it say to real estate agents:
"Don't sell me, I am still grieving over somebody who lived here eighty years ago, and do not destroy their belongings and their pride?" I believe not. Then the big deal is? We love to have security over here don't we? Even though that security is false. All it can take is for one of us to slip up somewhere at some time and boom, we are jammed.
It will not matter where you are. Then the big deal is? Anyone who gets into the experience of not having a home should not even see them selves as a home less person. I would have assumed that by the experience it would leave them liberated beyond the point of stereotypes. Not by what other people think, but by the opportunity the person can create by such a situation.
Actors are on the road. Filmmakers are on the road.
Politicians are in the air. Missionaries are always here and there. Musicians don't even know the meaning of homes, yet all these manage to create something profound through their absence than many millions of folk do by their presence.

No, the security of four walls is not the answer; otherwise colonies would not have sought other lands, foreign lands.
Four walls the "concrete jungle" waking up to the sight of a "brick wall" can't do it for everyone.
Otherwise why seek holidays or want to get away.

The atmosphere is here in our community and in our streets we don't have to run afar to cool of exotically when we are still living and can better it naturally. The atmosphere is here and it is for everybody, we just choose to view this as this one's property and that as that one's property.

Break down the walls and educate yourselves.
Stand up from floor and liberate yourself.

We both have something to learn and to give on and other. Through this we might just open the door to wiping off completely the "image" we like to use on people like you and me who just don't own a home.

Next post *.ACT,

by BornInIreland Sat Jul 12, 2003 03:54

"The grim necessities of a huge Campaign carried on for many years against the evils which lie at the root of all the miseries of modern life, attacked in a thousand and one forms by a thousand and one lieutenants, have led me step by step to contemplate as a possible solution of at least some of those problems the Scheme of social Selection and Salvation which I have here set forth.

When but a mere child the degradation and helpless misery of the poor "Stockingers" of my native town, wandering gaunt and hunger-stricken
through the streets droning out their melancholy ditties, crowding the Union or toiling like galley slaves on relief works for a bare
subsistence kindled in my heart yearnings to help the poor which have continued to this day and which have had a powerful influence on my
whole life. A last I may be going to see my longings to help the workless realised. I think I am." Bless him.


These are just some words reflect what the activist and founder of what has been one of the Late Great genuine aids in our time to the common people.

As of now and as a Christian I am getting through the pages and seeking what this man sought.

The statistics of what he achieved goes beyond any sort of measure which people give credit to in this day and age.

But this man did not live very long ago, he was human like you and me.
He was no myth but an activist for the people and for the spirit of men.

Certainly if anyone would apply themselves, relate themselves, effectuate them self with the situation of the people of the streets the way this man and his companions did then the issue we just read about cannot possibly be happening in today’s world where we have the most amount of charities and NGO’s one can ever imagine.

But it’s credo, rep, and status now isn’t it? Not with this man he even autographed for your king with his words of wisdom and his care for men.

The man and his companions are what we need today and by God’s grace some of us will read his words that are here and will seek what he sought, salvation for the souls of men.



*****************Activism*********************

"If we are to really benefit the poor, we can only do so by practical measures. We have merely to look round and see the kind of advantages
which wealthy men find indispensable for the due management of theirbusiness, and ask ourselves whether poor men cannot be supplied with
the same opportunities. The reason why they are not is obvious. To supply the needs of the rich is a means of making yourself rich; to supply the needs of the poor will involve you in trouble so out of proportion to the profit that the game may not be worth the candle."

His words. “Darkest England, and the Way Out.” The Book. Available here for free.


This man they don’t teach about him in British history, while they don’t mention his name on the streets no more, but he lived and his influence is can be relived today. And it still lasts till this day. But we must be prepared to take it as a need, a need for us and the greater community at large.

Known originally as the General’s mission.
The man Commander in chief of the army for salvation, better known as the Salvation Army. Messengers of the Gospel the good news, while social reformers for the less attended in their day. Lived in the Victorian era, but not commended to that effect. He kept by his rule and served his God, our Lord.
His name is General William Booth, Founder of the Salvation Army,
And his words can be relived as the situation of this day have us needing it. It can be read by the following link. Here you will get a first hand treatment of what it was to be in the shoes of this Christian social activist. A true reformer. Brethrens this book is not just some re-collect flash back on being down and out on your luck. No, this book is an active proposal a campaign yet to be fully fulfilled by any one man. This book is where contracts and appeals were made. When this book was written as if by a proclamation of faith what the author that is William of course was putting into action when writing was being done as it was written during its writing.

He even goes into illustrious imaging of how to view ourselves as no better than a fallen horse or what he calls the “Cab Horse fallen treatment” which human beings can only dream of. Quite a potent analogy it is.

Here is the book fellow activists, and influencers of our generation, learn of this man and his influence, seek what he sought and do the same if we want to help and if we want to heal.

I don’t know what most of us are waiting for but for those who choose to act and are already acting send this post to the concerned and I dedicate it to you all there, where? Where the work is.

Thank you,

Act now, it is never too late. But read first.
“Darkest England, and the Way Out.” The Book. Available free.

End.

by bernie bird Sat Jul 12, 2003 08:35

BorninIreland.... WHAT????
Thanks for the 150 year old quotes and all, very quaint, but I don't think that's what any of us were getting at here... things have changed a little since Victorian times...
To answer your question of two weeks ago, firstly, yes, any homeless person should be able to walk into a library and use the internet for free, as long as they can read or write, and with any savvy could find their way to this site (...tell your local street-bum).
Okay, in the dawn of the industrial age, when the Salvation Army was founded, a wide and long established network of halfway houses was being shut-down in favour of the grim govt-sponsered workhouse system, (and truly intolerant laws which sent gypsys to Ireland in droves for escape)--- note that Blair tried something near the same some years back by vowing to "eradicate" homelessness with back-to-work programs and incidentally achieved more by this than any of Major's govt's anti-traveller Criminal Justice Acts (I had a friend die by this)----
I'm suspicious, who are you and where is the news I asked about David?

(Dave: Check out this story for an update.)

by Jon Glackin - Issues Magazine Tue Jul 15, 2003 11:34 issues at eircom dot net

Heroic Irish team returns from Homeless World Cup!


“I hope that this pioneer project at the meeting point between football, culture and social integration will help to raise awareness and improve the plight of the homeless”

Gerhard Aigner, Chief Executive CEO, UEFA


After their valiant efforts against stronger opposition in the Homeless World Cup the Irish team returned from Graz in the early hours of Tuesday morning. They carry with them a powerful international message in the pursuit of the eradication of homelessness that they hope will echo throughout the World. After all Issues magazines efforts to get a team to represent Ireland at the Championships to raise the profile of homelessness here the dream became a reality for 8 homeless men who proudly represented their country against 17 other nations at Graz, Austria.

The men managed to reach the semi-finals of their section through sheer determination against the odds. Their opposition proved to be much more experienced and organized. After all these lads only got together as a team little under 2 months ago and this lack of experience proved to be the mitigating factor as they played against teams who had played together for the last year or more! Nevertheless they recorded impressive victories against the Welsh and Spanish sides in the tournament. The team attracted one of the largest and most vocal bunch of supporters in Graz as people from around the world cheered on the boys in green throughout the tournament that were shocked by the levels of homelessness in Ireland.

The message that came from the homeless community gathered in Graz was that through the medium of football which creates equality for all on the pitch also creates an increased sense of self esteem, a realization of the value of team work, fair play and fun. These positive factors trickle into the day to day to existence of those who find themselves without a permanent address and as such creates a valuable vehicle that must emanate from Graz to the streets of Ireland. With all this in mind Issues magazine will be creating the first homeless street league based on successful schemes found across the world in association with the FAI, Dublin City Council and various homeless agencies. The first training session will be held at Brickfield Park, Crumlin on Wednesday 23 July at 6pm, which will be open to all homeless men and woman in Dublin.


For any further information, interviews or images please contact Jon Glackin in the first instance at 01 873 0071/ 086 3140767/ [email protected]

www.streetsocer.org
www.Resonate.ie/streetsoccer

I am hoping that all who are concerned with Homeless issues will circulate this information as widely as possible!

by paula Fri Jul 18, 2003 15:33

Glad to hear you are back on your feet again, Chin up and go for it....

by JACK DAVIS Thu Jan 22, 2004 01:58 JACK_MAX_DAVIS_SF at YAHOO dot COM 405 VALENCIA STREET, SAN FRANCISCO, CA. (U.S.A.), 94103 1-415-571-5346

DAVID,
I FEEL FOR YOU. AFTER BEING SUCCESSFUL FOR 44 YEARS OF MY LIFE I ENDED UP HOMELESS IN NASHVILLE, TENNESSEE (U.S.A.) AND WAS FOR TWO YEARS. A MAN IN NEW YORK CITY PAID FOR ME TO MOVE TO SAN FRANCISCO TO VOLUNTEER FOR A MAYORAL CAMPAIGN, WHICH WAS HIGHLY ILLEGAL AND I LEFT IT AFTER AN ARGUEMENT AND ENDED UP HOMELESS AGAIN.
SAN FRANCISCO HAS A GREAT SOCAIL DERVICE PROGRAM AND I AM MOVING INTO HOUSING IN ABOUT 9 DAYS.
WHAT IS SAD HERE IS TWO OF "MY BEST FRIENDS" WERE KILLED ON THE STREETS OF NASHVILLE. ONE WAS MURDERED, WHO I FOUND ALIVE, BUT LATER DIED, AFTER BEING TAKEN OFF LIFE SUPPORT. AND THE OTHER WAS FOUND A MONTH AND A HALF AGO ON THE SIDE OF THE ROAD, IN THE WINTER, WITH NO COAT AND NO SHOES. THEY THINK HE HAD AN APPARENT MASSIVE HEART ATTACK, DRUG INDUCED....I THINK SPEEDBALLS.
ON GUY WAS 38 THE OTHER 34.
GOOD LUCK MY FRIEND,
KEEP IN TOUCH,
MY "EMPLOYMENT SPECIALIST" SAID I SHOULD BE ABLE TO MAKE $1,000 A WEEK HERE....I'LL SEND YOU SOME WHEN I GET TO WORK.
JACK

by Nicola Leonard - Youthreach Wed Mar 10, 2004 15:39 nicolaleonard at yahoo dot com 25 kilbrone estate, Ashford. D8. 0877621917

I really do feel for David but I also think he has great courage. I know myself I dont think I would last a day in his conditions. It breaks my heart when I see a homeless person on the side of the street being given dirty looks an hurried past, it makes my blood boil. This could happen to anyone in this day and age, we are not as secure as we think. I am no Joan of Arc for I also used to be not so much ignorant but more afraid of these people, that is until I was in a frightening situation myself along Gardeners Street, being followed more or less when a young homeless man came and walked me to safety. I find now most of these people are highly educated and well mannered just like anyone I know but these people have had a run of bad luck and all they need is a helping hand in order to get back on their feet. What is it with people and the lack of compassion nowadays. Nicola L

by saldanha Sat Mar 20, 2004 14:00 janela at bluewin dot ch

As Dave's story shows, what happened to him could happen to anyone. I think it's everyone's responsibility to help. Every person who walks on without helping is adding to the problem. Just think of all the empty rooms available in warm, clean houses, hotels, offices ! it's pure egoism on the part of the owners. And it's sickening to think of the hunger that rough sleepers experience while millions of OTHERS are gorging themselves in front of the TV, or in restaurants and bars.

The money, the food, the shelter - it's all there. It just needs to be distributed fairly.
It's that simple.

by K8 Tue Sep 20, 2005 02:09 cackaloo at hotmail dot com Wicklow

Your story'll stick in my head for the rest of my life. I wish I was your friend. Good luck man.

by dunk Tue Sep 20, 2005 17:53 fuspey at yahoo dot co dot uk

Theresa has been homeless for over 30 years on Dublins streets, she has seen the changes with the arrival of heroin, the arrival of the celtic tiger, she has seen many friends in her homeless family die
52 mins
http://radio.indymedia.org/uploads/theresa.wav

by Jessica - Christ Central Ministries Mon May 22, 2006 17:38

I know some of you think that homeless people put themselves in that situation but that is not true at all. I am 22 years old and am married with two young children. My father runs a homeless shelter called Christ Central Ministries. We have seen so many adults come in who's houses have burned down, or they were abandoned by their parents when they were only children. If you are brought up without guidance or parents, how are you suppose to know where to go, what to do, and how to better educate yourself. No all homeless people asked to be where they are or who they are. So by not helping homeless people just because some have put a bad name on others is wrong. The Bible clearly says to feed and house the homeless. Do unto others as you would have others do unto you. Put yourselves in their shoes, and ALWAY remember homeless people have feelings too. You have no idea how they got in that situation so don't judge them, and you may one day be in that position too.

In Christ Name,

Jessica

by compassionate Fri Jul 28, 2006 17:16

I feel that some of the people on this site have no compassion because they have no idea what its like to be homeless otherwise their opinions would be diferent.I mean try and put yourself in davids position.Nobody asks or wants to be homeless they just fall into the cracks of society.

by Boland Thu Mar 27, 2014 22:03

It's so easy to lambast the downtrodden, and even easier on the internet. Many of these comments are sickening for their lack of compassion. Of all the places I have been, my homeland has the worst divergence of attitudes when it comes to being a decent person towards those who are in trouble. It's sickening to think that if this happens to me there will be people, some of them employees of the state, who would rather if I was dead and gone off their streets. Our whole country needs to change, every person.

by dribble Fri Mar 28, 2014 14:30

Just read davids story , i hope now david has found somewhere to kip at least and is off the streets for good. Its been over ten years,so i hope things have changed for the better. Your story is heart-breaking in every sense of the word,i know you didnt want to evoke sympathy but you have with me anyway.

Good luck and i hope you all the best in life,being homeless must be tough,i cannot imagine what it must have been like to loose all your personal belongings after you had that one stay in that awful hostel(which had no proper supervision).

Hostels in ireland are like cattle marts for the down trodden,they really dont care there is minimal security and no lockers in a lot of places,i used to work in a hostel for homeless (i wont name names as i dont want the former employer to read this and give me a bad reference) and i have to say the way that hostel was run was awful.

Nothing good for anybody having a stay there,and most of the time they would have long termers there,and trouble-some homeless clients always causing a stir with other newer homeless clients there.

They would let in a few new homeless guys who were no trouble,but the place was overcrowded and they would be booted out,sometimes they would be allowed to sit in the kitchen just to get out of the biting cold at night.

It was a ''wet-house'' and very initmidating,on my first day there i had to clean up needles off the floor,and clean up a very dirty room with piss everywhere.

They wouldn't screen who they would let in and it made it a very dangerous place.