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The Saker
A bird's eye view of the vineyard

offsite link Alternative Copy of thesaker.is site is available Thu May 25, 2023 14:38 | Ice-Saker-V6bKu3nz
Alternative site: https://thesaker.si/saker-a... Site was created using the downloads provided Regards Herb

offsite link The Saker blog is now frozen Tue Feb 28, 2023 23:55 | The Saker
Dear friends As I have previously announced, we are now “freezing” the blog.? We are also making archives of the blog available for free download in various formats (see below).?

offsite link What do you make of the Russia and China Partnership? Tue Feb 28, 2023 16:26 | The Saker
by Mr. Allen for the Saker blog Over the last few years, we hear leaders from both Russia and China pronouncing that they have formed a relationship where there are

offsite link Moveable Feast Cafe 2023/02/27 ? Open Thread Mon Feb 27, 2023 19:00 | cafe-uploader
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Public Inquiry
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Public Inquiry >>

Human Rights in Ireland
Promoting Human Rights in Ireland

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Lockdown Skeptics

The Daily Sceptic

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Thousands of supporters of Tommy Robinson marched in London on Saturday demanding his release, with police deployed to keep them apart from a large counter-protest.
The post Thousands Shut Down London As Protesters Chant ?Free Tommy? appeared first on The Daily Sceptic.

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The post Seven Highlights From Robert F. Kennedy Jr.?s HHS Senate Confirmation Hearings appeared first on The Daily Sceptic.

offsite link No Laughing Matter as Net Zero Nutters Target Your Anaesthetics and Painkillers Sun Feb 02, 2025 09:00 | Chris Morrison
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The post No Laughing Matter as Net Zero Nutters Target Your Anaesthetics and Painkillers appeared first on The Daily Sceptic.

offsite link Trigger Warning: Your Local University, Literary Society or School Board May Contain Nuts Sun Feb 02, 2025 07:00 | Steven Tucker
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The post Trigger Warning: Your Local University, Literary Society or School Board May Contain Nuts appeared first on The Daily Sceptic.

offsite link News Round-Up Sun Feb 02, 2025 00:51 | Will Jones
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The post News Round-Up appeared first on The Daily Sceptic.

Lockdown Skeptics >>

Analysis of Shannon 1st March

category national | miscellaneous | news report author Sunday March 02, 2003 17:27author by kev - personal capacity Report this post to the editors

Well, heres my analysis, I feel that the small numbers that turned out for both demos in Shannon, prove that the GNAW are, at best premature in their actions, and at worst completely wrong in the belief that Direct Action is the way forward for the anti-war campaign.

The fact that the numbers were so small proves this. At most the GNAW assembled 250ish, and the IAWM 900ish. The direct action initiave was a complete failure. I'm sure the GNAW hoped that 1000's would turn up and that they could get a sizeable amount of these people to attend their protest. However, precisely as a result of the publicisation of the direct action, and the spin by the media, the numbers failed to show. You can blame the media all you want - and I do too, for many things - but we all knew that this was exactly what was going to happen in this case. Its no use crying over something that was inevitable in the circumstances. But I still expected more than 1200ish altogether.

But they didn't, so the GNAW have to face the fact that the mass movement against war in this country (the 150,000 or so that marched in dublin)are more in-line with the IAWM view of how things should be brought forward - mass demos, community and workplace groups, strikes, walkouts and of course the all important role of the Shannon workers.

Even doing an anti-war stall in the city centre during the week, people were coming up asking "are you them violent ones" etc. This is not to say thats how I see GNAW, but this was a pretty frequent description of the direct actioners by the general public, or at least the general public on that day. The media has obviously played a role in this, and this cannot be helped. Therefore i see direct action in Shannon at this stage as a wrong tactic. But I assume many in the GNAW see it as a principle rather than a tactic. To me its not, there is a time for DA (water charges, bin charges, student occupations, to name a few).

I feel the attitude of many of those who post here is that the 150,000 people marching thru dublin was 'pointless because the government didn't listen'. Well I didn't expect them to in all honesty. This is why we must build the anti-war campaign. The attitude of some was the govt didnt listen, forget about building, lets tear down the fences. To me this is completely wrong and undermines the role of ordinary people in this movement - and isn't anarchy meant to be all about self empowerment? The actions a few can easily alienate ordinary people.

Now, on another posting 'Donnacha' stated:

"If fair weather friends are going to decide not to take part in a protest because they don't agree with another groups' tactics (that they can easily keep away from) then they're no value at all to any movement."

While I agree that the PANA, Shinners, Greens and Labour should not have caved in to the hype about violence, this is one of the most elitist remarks I have heard on the wire. so lets just say that a possible 8,000 people would have turned up at Shannon if there was to be no direct action - by this reckoning the 7,000 that didnt come are of "no value" to the movement??? Interesting logic there. Face it, many people stayed away because there was confusion about the issue, the media played its role, as did the pro-UN groups mentioned above, but so too did the GNAW and their tactics/principles. I went, but I knew what was the basic plan was, and I knew that the protest was important.

It has also been mentioned several times that the IAWM muscled in on the GNAW demo. I don't actually know the ins-and-outs of this, but were the two demos not decided without prior knowledge of either groups as to the others plans? (correct me if I'm wrong on this point). However, to my mind this doesnt really matter as had the IAWM not called a protest for the same day, the GNAW numbers would still not have been any more than those who turned up yesterday. And the same result would have occured.

Again, i say that the overwhelming majority of those involved in the anti-war campaign are at this stage not in favour of the tactic of direct action at shannon. To me, the 1st March demo proves this, and that further such actions which will be exploited by the media and the goverment will only undermine the movement.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, what is needed is not 'Direct Action', it is Mass Action with Direction.

(and I suppose - que vitriol)

 #   Title   Author   Date 
   sabotage     pat c    Sun Mar 02, 2003 18:31 
   2 Qs     pat c    Sun Mar 02, 2003 19:23 
   what if     kev    Sun Mar 02, 2003 19:24 
   analysis-analyses     T Barry    Mon Mar 03, 2003 00:07 
   Most people against war...................     James    Mon Mar 03, 2003 00:09 
   Reality not Fantasy     Derek    Mon Mar 03, 2003 00:53 
   St. James     non-aligned peacenik    Mon Mar 03, 2003 01:06 
   reply to derek     T Barry    Mon Mar 03, 2003 02:50 
   A practical suggestion     Otis    Mon Mar 03, 2003 04:48 
 10   Questions for Pat C     Bolloxy    Mon Mar 03, 2003 11:30 
 11   2 Qs for Pat Corcoran     Pat Corcoran watcher    Mon Mar 03, 2003 12:10 
 12   Balaclavas     Simpson Eh?    Mon Mar 03, 2003 15:47 
 13   Puerile SP     pat c    Mon Mar 03, 2003 15:56 
 14   medic scare     patc    Mon Mar 03, 2003 16:00 
 15   for mass direct action     conor (wsm personal capacity)    Mon Mar 03, 2003 16:50 
 16   Hi Krossie     Ray    Mon Mar 03, 2003 16:52 
 17   Pat C ---------Yawn     zzzzzzzzzzzz    Mon Mar 03, 2003 20:48 
 18   ZZZZMaybe We Can Find Some Integrity For The SP     pat c    Tue Mar 04, 2003 13:01 
 19   Conor     Derek    Tue Mar 04, 2003 19:20 
 20   reply tand questions for derek     T Barry    Tue Mar 04, 2003 20:17 
 21   its all a cunning plan     kev    Wed Mar 05, 2003 00:44 
 22   kev     pat c    Wed Mar 05, 2003 11:36 
 23   Message for Pat     ?    Thu Mar 06, 2003 02:23 
 24   SP debating style     pat c    Thu Mar 06, 2003 11:35 


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